Oral History Program Kye Hallows Interviewed by Sarah Storey 17 July 2019 Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Kye Hallows Interviewed by Sarah Storey 17 July 2019 Copyright © 2022 by Weber State University, Stewart Library Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. The working files, original recording, and archival copies are housed in the University Archives. Project Description The Beyond Suffrage Project was initiated to examine the impact women have had on northern Utah. Weber State University explored and documented women past and present who have influenced the history of the community, the development of education, and are bringing the area forward for the next generation. The project looked at how the 19th Amendment gave women a voice and representation, and was the catalyst for the way women became involved in the progress of the local area. The project examines the 50 years (1870-1920) before the amendment, the decades to follow and how women are making history today. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management This work is the property of the Weber State University, Stewart Library Oral History Program. It may be used freely by individuals for research, teaching and personal use as long as this statement of availability is included in the text. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Hallows, Kye, an oral history by Sarah Storey, 17 July 2019, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. iii Kye Hallows Circa 2019 Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Kye Hallows, conducted on July 17, 2019, by Sarah Storey. Kye discusses his life, his memories, and the impact of the 19th Amendment. Reagan Baird, the video technician, is also present during this interview. SS: Ok, today is July 17th 2019, and we are here with Kye Hallows, and I Sarah Storey am interviewing him, and Reagan Baird is recording for us. SS: When and where were you born? KH: I was born in Ogden, Utah in 1991 at the Ogden Regional Hospital. SS: So have you been in Ogden your whole life? KH: No, I’ve been here for most of my life and taken short... you know, I did that whole thing in high school, “I can’t wait to move out of Utah, I can’t wait to get out of here,” and I did and I moved to Denver for a while and I moved to St. Louis for a while and now I’m back here and I love it here now. SS: So, is that what brought you back, you just missed home? KH: Yeah, I missed home and, I mean, you’re always searching for something and sometimes it takes going halfway across the world to realize that it’s right in front of you. SS: That’s true. So when you were young, was there any women that you looked up to and if so, why? KH: Yeah, for sure, um, I mean, I... my mom, always, has been my number one role model, but then it was like, people like my grandma and how cool it was to imagine her navigating being in the music and art scene, and you know, the 1 earlier times, and then people like... I mean there’s so many inspiring women, where do I even start. Like Audre Lorde, I loved that and I mean, I read Stephanie Meyer Twilight books and was inspired by her. So there was... yeah, definitely not a shortage of inspiring women and I think mostly it would be my mom and my grandma and then writers, for sure. SS: You said your grandma had something to do with the arts and music scene? What did she do? KH: So, both actually, so my grandmother was an elementary school art teacher, which was... cause then on the weekends we’d have art lesson, you know every Saturday we’d go over to grandma’s and have our little art lesson. And then my mom actually was a music, an elementary school music teacher. She’s retired now, but... so just kind of fun, right-brained background people, if you will. SS: So, from your experiences, like with your grandmother and your mother and... do you have children? KH: No. No. SS: Ok, I wasn’t sure. Just from what you’ve seen of others, how do you think that the role of mothers has changed over the years? KH: Oh man. I mean I watch my sister with her kids. I wouldn’t want to have kids in this world and I don’t know... I mean, there’s more options for people to say, “No, I don’t want to,” now and sometimes I wonder why anyone would say yes. Because I just feel like the world is just in a really dark place, especially in this country right now and obviously it’s much worse in other places. But we’re kind of looked on as this leader and we’re kind of in a dark time and it’s not a time that I 2 would... So I think it’s changed in a lot of ways, cause I think navigating... I mean, conversations that even five, ten years ago you never would have had, which in some ways I think is really good. But in some ways... I would not want to have those conversations with a child. Yeah, and I mean we’ve been hearing these horrible news stories about people plucked right off of campuses and horrible things like... It’s just scary, I would always be worried. I don’t think I could ever sleep at night. SS: So as a child, were you encouraged to pursue an education? KH: Yes, I was, and I actually have a lot to say about this, I hope you’re ready. So, yes, I was, and I grew up in a super LDS family, very much the expectation of, “Yeah, you should get an education because we’re a middle class family and that’s what you do.” But it really is... you’re finding a man, and then you’re going to have babies, and then you’re going to have the life and be a stay-at-home mom. That is everything that my whole future, or past has been, really. And I came out when I was 14. I came out as a lesbian when I was 14 years old. And then my parents were in total distress, of course. That... doesn’t go well with the Church. But then, interestingly enough, they started to be even more concerned that I get an education, because they started to think of me as, “Ok, maybe I’m not going to have a financial plan man, so I better be my own.” And so, yes, then they pushed even more and even more that I get it done and I had no interest in going to college. I didn’t want to at all, I’m a business owner, I’m an entrepreneur, that’s how my mind works. This school stuff is busy work for me and it’s like... So, 3 yeah, I went and I finished and I got the four-year degree, but it wasn’t because I wanted to. SS: So what did you get your degree in? KH: Communications. Which, hindsight, I wish I would have done the business degree, it would have helped me a lot right now where I’m stumbling through, like, commercial loan process and all this stuff. Like, “Wait, what am I doing?” But you know, you work it out, you figure it out as you go, so it’s fine. SS: Yeah. It works out. So, you kind of travelled around like you said. So once you received your degree, what kind of options were available to you or did you start your business right away after that or how did that go? KH: Yeah, I actually did my senior project as like writing a business plan of sorts for my first business which is “Lavender Vinyl Records Shop” on 25th Street. So yeah, I did, yeah, I did my whole college career I was like, “Oh, this is stupid and this isn’t for me,” like it really was the whole time, I wasn’t into it and I didn’t have the best attitude about it and I probably was kind of a jerk to some of my professors, kind of going back I’m like, “Man... I was a little asshole that I didn’t ever show up.” And I wasn’t trying to be, it was just like... it wasn’t really my thing. But... I’m glad I’m done with it. I still have nightmares about not graduating Colleen Packers class, like all the time! And she’s the nicest woman in the world. SS: So then you just started your business like right after college? KH: Yeah, so I mean, I graduated in April and... we were already like full-fledged, we opened in July, so I was... yeah, we were already in the process of like rerenov... doing whatever painting and all that stuff we needed to do and all that. 4 SS: So other than not really wanting to go to school, what were some of the challenges you faced during school, like while you were in school? KH: Um, I think that it was... I mean, every student can relate to like the struggle of trying to pay for everything and work enough. I was super fortunate and I know I am so privileged that I didn’t have to worry about the cost of tuition, my parents were like, “You’re going, we’re paying for it.” And I am super fortunate, but even just like, I was like, “Ok, well if I’m going to college, then I’m definitely not living at home.” So, yeah, it’s the balance of like... it’s silly, but its the balance of like, “Do I have enough gas in my car to park in this shit show and then figure out how I’m going to run all the way up there and still get there on time?” So really just like the struggle of balancing out everything and sometimes it was like... I worked in the service industry the whole time and sometimes it’s like, “I’m really broke right now, I really want to pick up a shift, and I might pick up a shift in the time that I would be in class, cause I know that this is...” So really just balance. Yeah, so, I think balance and for me I just wasn’t... I would rather be in a more hands on... I think maybe a tech program would have been more up my alley? I don’t know. SS: Yeah, the whole like starving student thing. I know it’s a cliché, but it’s true, and we’ve all been there. KH: Oh, it totally is. And some people much worse than others. I mean there’s lots of couples that have a kid or they have... older family members that they’re also taking care of, like there’s just so many worse situations, but it’s a hard balance for sure. Yeah. SS: What was your first job? 5 KH: Um, let’s see, my very first job I got, I was bussing tables at a Mexican restaurant in Layton that I grew up by, and I... loved it. I loved it and the restaurant actually closed and went out of business and I was so sad and that’s why I didn’t get to work there anymore and I was so sad. But before that I had... me and my little brother had our little lawn mowing business and we, you know, pushed the lawn mower halfway up the street and mowed the neighbor’s lawn. We had a... by the time I graduate from high school, we had a whole operation going on. But my first real job was at the Mexican restaurant busing tables. SS: So it sounds like you were in the food industry, is that what you did most the time between then and your business? KH: Yeah. So I’ve worked with Café Mercantile for ten years now, almost, and I still work with them, I have my bakery now as like a co-op out of their location downtown. And so, yeah, I’ve been in the food service industry for forever. SS: I didn’t know about your bakery, so would you mind to elaborate? KH: Yeah, so we started Lavender Vinyl in July of 2016 and then... my and my business partner always wanted to have like a little café aspect of it, but we didn’t have the capital for it, so it was kind of like, “We’ll do it when it works out.” And then a year later we started Lavender Kitchen, we got like a permit to do... basically we were using someone’s kitchen overnight, so packaged goods and things like that out of there, and then we started doing events, farmer’s market, things like that. It’s all vegan, so that’s kind of what our stand out thing is, and then, yeah, like... let’s see about a year ago almost, my wife quit her job to come 6 on full-time for our bakery, so we both work there full-time now, which is really exciting. It took a lot of work to get there. SS: So how do you bake every day? KH: Yep. Five days a week. Yeah, it is. It’s a lot of work but I love it. I love it so much and we do a lot of events and we get to see so many fun people and I... I miss all my customers from the coffee shop, I miss not seeing them, so I’m really happy to be back in there. SS: What was your motivation to start your business? KH: I have an authority issue. That’s really what it comes down to. I don’t want to answer to anybody. Like if I mess it up and I’m the one that is responsible. Then you can only be mad at yourself, you know? And not to say that I can’t respect people, I can be a very respectful person when it’s necessary, but I also think that there’s a lot ass-kissing that’s unnecessary on all fronts. So yeah, really that’s the bottom line, I didn’t want to answer to somebody else. I don’t do well with other people telling me what to do. SS: So tell me a little bit about Lavender Vinyl. Like, what brought about that idea, how did you get into that? KH: Yeah, sure. So me and Blake, who’s my business partner, we both worked at Gray Whale forever. All throughout high school and we always just had this silly thing, “Oh, it’d be so cool if we just had our own,” you know. And we talked about it so much and then I had a really awesome community of people that I really cannot attribute it to anything else other than that. Like I work with small business people every day, like working in the coffee shop, so many of our clients, you 7 know, and it’s not... I get to see people from city council and I get to see professors from Weber State, and I get to see starving students, like just the amount of networking there. So when we said, “Ok, we want to do this,” we had the community backing to do it and we had to do it really quietly at first, because he was still employed at Gray Whale which was kind of a competitor. But then they ended up, we told them what we were doing and they ended up donating like a bunch of product to us, like we just had a really amazing crew of people that have helped push us up to be able to start a business and to start another business and, yeah, I really think what propelled it forward was community and the reason we wanted to do it was we were nerds about records. Like, watching High Fidelity, just like “Oh, this album, I can remember it was 1972 and I was walking my dog wearing a yellow sweater.” But for real, there’s a thing about a song, like you hear a song and it gives you a memory that nothing else does. So. SS: So where does the Lavender come from? Like, is that special to you guys? KH: Yes, yes. So lavender is actually an old school queer reference, which is why we called it that. The... so there was, with the like National Organization for Women and then, like lesbians weren’t really allowed. Like they were kind of excluded. Feminists were like elitists and didn’t want to be clumped in with lesbians, too. And so there was like an infiltration of, what they called themselves, “lavender menaces,” and it was all these lesbians that were, they cared so much about this feminist agenda, but also like, “We’re women, too. Why aren’t we being a part of this? Why would you exclude us from this?” And kind of infiltrated those rallies 8 and protests and stuff like. So yep, and I think probably... you could look it up, but probably something even further back than that where they decided to call themselves the lavender menaces. I’m sure that there’s even a further back queer history tie-in somewhere. SS: That’s awesome. I’m a Women and Gender Studies minor and I didn’t know that, like I feel ashamed right now, so thank you, you just taught me something. KH: No, no! You should look it up, there’s, um, there’s this really awesome book that you should read. It’s called “Odd Girls and Twilight Lovers” and it’s all about like the lesbian and femin—and if you’re Women and Gender Studies. It’s such an interesting book. I’m sure they have it here in your beautiful library. SS: That’s awesome. That’s a great story. Was there a time where you felt like you were brave at work? Where you had to really stand up? KH: Um, well, interesting thing that’s happening in my life right now is I’ve actually kind of been transitioning away from feminine pronouns into like a non-binary situation. I had top surgery in January and that’s something that I feel is very important for this project, because it should be all inclusive and I love that. But, so, I did an interview with Slug magazine like two weeks ago and it was an amazing interview and like, I felt like for the first—not the first time, but one... few and far between does an interviewer that’s writing for a newspaper actually... SS: Not spin it. KH: Yeah, and you don’t get to see the transcript. So it’s very rarely that an interviewer for a newspaper story actually captures the essence of what you’re trying to tell in the story. So this person did an amazing job and I’m so excited 9 and it’s the Fourth of July and I get this, get the email that’s like “Ok, magazines went out last night, here’s the digital, start sharing it, blah, blah, blah.” Well they referred to me as he throughout the entire article. Which... we didn’t have that conversation, so kind of weird. And like, I think that it was very much that they were trying to be overly progressive and accepting. But totally neglected to ask what my preferred pronouns would be and so it was like... I get when people get misgendered when it’s like the gender that they were assigned at birth, but this was the other way so it kind of got wacky. And the magazine was already out. So, pretty much I’m getting off on a long story, but I kind of got thrown into like... it’s now public... it’s all this thing that I kind of had going on outside is kind of out there for everybody to ask questions and even with my business. I mean it’s really on blast for that and you know, we don’t, we’re very much queer business owner, like that’s... number one thing that I want people to know about me, if they remember anything about me, so I’m not ashamed about it. But yeah, it’s a weird thing to be navigating. So I think that shows some bravery. Even though it wasn’t intentional, I could have thrown a fit about it and made a big scene about it, and instead I’m like, “Ok, well, there’s something weird going on, so let’s just...” SS: Deal with it? KH: Yep. SS: So that actually brings an interesting question, I think people do kind of assume, and like you said, sometimes that can go one way and sometimes it can go the other. I mean like your personal feelings, it would be better to just have asked, I 10 would imagine? I mean, that’s how I feel, if people want to know something about me, “Just ask me.” KH: Right, don’t try to beat around the bush. SS: So, yeah, that’s... unfortunately things like that happen. I mean at least... you said the rest of the article was well-written. KH: It was, and like... maybe that’s what needed to happen, maybe it was some weird earthly shift that was just like, “Ok, stop twirling around it, just let it be.” And that’s not the case, I think that’s why I was feeling offended by it, is I don’t identify as a male. And I don’t think that I ever will. And so I was like, “Oh, what it this?” It’s just I guess, when you decide to do a business in a community like this where we have such a tight-knit community and everyone helps each other and we all know each other and we’re all... we’re all friends and we all donate to each other’s things to help grow and... but the other side of that is that there’s a lack of privacy sometimes and your personal business, you’ve got to be ready to talk about. It’s not personal anymore. SS: Ok, well I like that. So, I’m going to change my... choice of words here. KH: I love that! See this is good. See, but I didn’t tell you that cause I was like, “You know what, yeah, I will do this, because I think it’s really important to...” SS: Yeah. Well, they like to focus on the word woman and girl, which I understand because there is a lack of women in history, right? But it’s a wider net than that, it’s a spectrum. KH: That’s exactly what it is. SS: Yeah. So sometimes we need to not focus so much on these little words. 11 KH: It’s a spectrum. I like that. SS: So how, as a person— KH: Oh, I like this. SS: --do you define courage? KH: Um, I think that I would define courage as standing up for what you believe in, despite whatever may come of it. And you know, that’s like telling your grandpa to stop making racist comments at family dinner and that’s like, you know, owning up to, yeah, I messed up and that was my mistake, and I’m not going to look to push it off on the next guy that could very easily maybe be like, “Oh, I didn’t do that it was him,” especially in the food industry, you can so easily just be like, “It wasn’t my fault the tomatoes weren’t cut.” You know, but, yeah, it’s a silly thing, but it’s owning up to what you as a person, as an individual, believe in and care about and to me, that’s what courage is. SS: So, you sound like you’re very busy. KH: I’m a busy person. SS: So, how do you balance work and home life, because obviously you have a lot going on with work and then you mentioned your wife, but...? KH: So, it’s actually been so much better for us now that we work together, and I know a lot of couples would be like, “Nightmare.” But like we were doing the life before where we were both working so many hours apart that it was just like at the end of the day, it was just like tired, done, no energy. How do you keep a relationship alive with that? So I think we have a really good balance, she’s a morning person and I’m not, so she gets up and goes in and opens the shop 12 really early and then she gets off earlier and can go to the gym or whatever and so, we really do have to schedule time out to do a good balance, and I... you know, my friends all make fun of me, cause it’s like, “Can you pencil me in?” and it’s like you’re not trying to be that person, but yeah, I need to pencil you in! You’ve got to give me at least like... I’m a busy person and I have a lot of social obligations and not only that but I have a big social circle that I want, that I love, I love all my friends, I want to balance all these relationships, and it’s about scheduling. That’s the only way to make it work. SS: That’s so true. You have to have a calendar when you’re ambitious, you just have to. KH: And not a phone calendar, I have a real calendar that I write in with a pen! That’s the only way, I can’t... there’s too many bombardments from the phone all the time. SS: I totally get that. That’s awesome. And it’s nice that you and your wife work well together because I think that’s how you know you’ve found the right person for you, because if you can stand to be with them all day, every day... that’s a lot. KH: Then you’re probably in good shape, right? I hope so. We’ve only been married for three years, so we’ll see. SS: This question they added and I can’t avoid the term... KH: Nope, just go for it, it’s alright. SS: It’s kind of like a probing question. So, how would you define the term, “women’s work,” like the old-fashioned “women’s work,” what does that mean to you? 13 KH: It makes me feel like that. Ugh. Um, yeah, “women’s work” is like... making sure that the food is prepped and cut and making sure that the bathroom’s clean and making sure that your feet don’t hurt at the end of the night and making sure that the kids are taken care of and... appointments for kids and, ugh. Just... it absolutely blows my mind that it ever was acceptable for there to be, “Ok, I’m Dad and I go to work and make all the money and then I just get to come home and sit on my ass while you do everything else that you’ve already been doing all day.” I don’t... understand how that was ever a reasonable thing, but we are in a patriarchal society, so of course it was set up that way, I mean if you were a dude, why would not set it up that way. I’m happy to see, and maybe this kind of goes with what I was saying earlier, how like I wouldn’t want to be a parent because it’s so scary and it’s a dark world, but at the same time, it’s a world where queer people can have more rights than we’ve ever had before and where women, in a way, have more rights than they’ve had before even though they’re having a very public battle right now, I think that that’s a good, I think that’s a good thing, I think that it’s opening lots of cans of worms that are just dying to escape. SS: How do you think women receiving the right to vote has shaped or influenced history, your community, and yourself, personally? KH: Um, I mean, we... we wouldn’t be here, none of us. None of us would be here. The world would be a completely different place. I think about the “Handmaid’s Tale” and I can’t even watch it cause it makes me feel so sick to my stomach, but it’s like not that far off from what our world could have or could become if there 14 weren’t strong women that were willing to fight for the vote and if there weren’t people like Ruth Bader Ginsberg that are like, “No, I’m challenging that law and I’m going to read into the background of all this so that I know just the words to...” Like, it’s crazy how much more effort women have had to put in to get not even an equal outcome. To get 0.75 to the dollar of an outcome. Um, but yeah I can’t even imagine. I mean, myself as everything that I am, there would be no possible world for me to exist in if it wasn’t for the women that fought for the right to vote. And I’m really grateful that I don’t have to do that. SS: Is there anything else that you would like to add that I didn’t touch on, cause this is very specific. So is there anything that you would like to have added or any advice that you would like to give to other people out there? KH: I mean, this is Ogden, the community here is so awesome and I, that’s what I always want to say at the end of anything, because I just... there’s so many good resources and here, at Weber State, and in the community of Ogden that are like, “We want to help each other.” And I want to help people, I want to... you know, if I can help another small business owner like somebody’s helped me, or I can help a woman or another queer person, like... somebody else that needs a little wing, I got you. That’s all. That’s all I have to say. SS: That’s awesome, I think that’s great. You’re very inspiring. And for being so young, you’ve done so much, it’s amazing. KH: Well, thank you. I’m a busy body. It’s all the coffee. There’s always things to be done. 15