Oral History Program Livy Owok Interviewed by Ademola Adetula 2 August 1972 i Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Livy Owok Interviewed by Ademola Adetula 2 August 1972 Copyright © 2014 by Weber State University, Stewart Library ii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. Archival copies are placed in University Archives. The Stewart Library also houses the original recording so researchers can gain a sense of the interviewee's voice and intonations. Project Description The Weber State College/University Student Projects have been created by students working with several different professors on the Weber State campus. The topics are varied and based on the student's interest or task for a specific assignment. These oral history assignments were created to help Weber State students learn the value and importance of recording public history and to benefit the expansion of the Weber State oral history collections. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management All literary rights in the manuscript, including the right to publish, are reserved to the Stewart Library of Weber State University. No part of the manuscript may be published without the written permission of the University Librarian. Requests for permission to publish should be addressed to the Administration Office, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, Utah, 84408. The request should include identification of the specific item and identification of the user. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Owok, Livy, an oral history by Ademola Adetula, 2 August 1972, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. iii Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Livy Owok. The interview was conducted on August 2, 1972, by Ademola Adetula, in Adetula’s home. Owok discusses the Civil War in Nigeria and shares views and opinions on the War. AA: Do you mind telling me something about yourself? LO: I'm a student at the University of Utah and a Nigerian from the South-eastern State of Nigeria. AA: I'd like to know how you come to be in Salt Lake City to attend school here. LO: I was a student formerly at Weber State and then I transferred to the University of Utah. I came here immediately after the civil war in Nigeria and I couldn't get immediate admission into any of the universities in Nigeria. So I decided to go to school outside of Nigeria. AA: How far have you gone in your schooling right now? LO: I am a junior at the moment. AA: Do you hope to graduate in a year’s time? LO: Yes, either a year or a year and a half, depending on how far I can go. AA: What do you hope to do after? LO: Possibly to go into graduate school. AA: Another question—which part of Nigeria were you in Nigeria before, during, and after the Nigerian Civil War? LO: I was in Eastern Nigeria, in precisely the area that was affected by the Nigerian Civil War. And after, when the South eastern State was liberated by the Federal troops, I went to Lagos, and from Lagos I came over to this country. AA: What effects did the war have on your area? 1 LO: A lot of effects! And socially a lot of families have been affected—and financially and other wise. Like any other war many of the people from all areas were in the army; in fact, in both armies, the Biafran army and the Nigerian army. Many had been killed; many had been wounded. Socially, many lost their money and houses during the trouble and politically, think, there is now a lot of administration going on in the state which was almost unheard of before the war. AA: What, in your view, are the main causes of the civil war? LO: Well, in my opinion, that would be a long history, but to make it short, the Nigerian Civil War arose because of the inability of the N.C.N.C. and that was the ruling party mainly from Eastern Nigeria. It was because of the inability of the N.C.N.C. to accept defeat. That, in my opinion, was the main cause because if they were able to accept defeat in the last election before the war, they wouldn't have turned to secession as being the answer to their problems. AA: What do you think Nigeria could have done to avoid such a terrible war? LO: Well, it’s a human problem and it has a lot to do with the politicians at that time. I think the politicians should have accepted the defeat and wait for another time, another election at the polls or had waited to see why they failed in the election and make some corrections where it was necessary. AA: For the past five years, nearly all African countries have experienced overnight civilian government take-over by the military officers. Do you justify this attitude of take-over? LO: There is not a yes or a no answer to that. I think it should be discussed. In certain areas you have issues that maybe the politicians are unable to handle. And the military feel that they could handle them better, so they feel like taking over the power. In another area it could be just one person's ambition to feel like governing, so he decides to use the military or use the existing tribal conflicts, or any of these things just to have a chance to gain power. 2 AA: What about military coups in general? LO: Oh, I think they are bloody. There is hardly a military coup in which no one is killed, so it’s bloody in reality. And my other opinion would be, if the military government is able to do anything for any country with a minimum amount of killings or plunders, then maybe they are right in taking over power. These things vary depending on the country. One country’s problem may not be the same as another country's problem. It has a lot of variables. AA: How did the Nigerian Civil War start? LO: The Nigerian Civil War started when the Easterners, who were living in Northern Nigeria, were driven out of Northern Nigeria. That would be precisely the thing that triggered the war. Aside from that, there were a lot of underlying causes like— Easterners were dominating most of the Civil Service in the North and yet were not respectful to the Northerners. The differences of opinions and the outlook of life on everything affected the whole thing. So the Northerners felt that even when the Easterners were living in the North they didn't respect their traditions; and at the same time they were controlling a lot of things. At the same time there were northerners living in the East who were not well taken care of. They had their own grievances. That would have been the triggering cause that led to the war. AA: What is your feeling about Nigeria’s Military Government? LO: I think the man at the top, General Gowon, is a gentleman and a nice man. Like any other military government who were trained to light and not to govern, they have their own discrepancies in the area of administration. But then I think they have tried to compensate by using the politicians as commissioners to guide and direct them. Most of the men at the top are really decent men. But somewhere along the line you have trouble with some of the people who are supposed to take 3 care of certain things who are not doing very well, or are actually using the military government to seek their own private ambitions. AA: Do you mind telling me something about Colonel Ojukwu, the head of Biafra? LO: Ojukwu was a child of circumstances. It’s life’s events that make people what they are. I think he came into either the military or the political time, or either the military or political atmosphere, and felt that he had all the answers to all the problems, which I think is almost impossible for one person to have. And because it was at a time when there were a lot of disturbances, he just decided to bring these answers out. Unfortunately, his answers just were not the right ones. AA: On the 17th of last month, I interviewed three people who stated that the difference between Gowon and Ojukwu was their ideas about ruling Nigeria. May I know your opinion toward their differences of ruling Nigeria? LO: To me the main difference is that Ojukwu relied and depended on coercive power; always ready to force people. He pretended to be interested in organization which he wasn't really interested in. Whereas Gowon was not that interested in pushing people around. He does it only when he has absolutely no alternative. So I would say that Gowon believes more in discussion, believes more in hearing from all sides instead of letting his own personal conviction be the answer. He would rather hear from different sides before he decides. He would try as much as possible not to use force. AA: How do you feel about foreign countries towards Nigeria during and-after the civil war? Do you think they took any important roles? Were their roles effective or are they of the type that wouldn't be any help to Nigeria or do you think they were doing it for their own interest? LO: I think some of the foreign countries were sympathetic to Nigeria as a whole. Some of them, although not on a governmental basis, but on the masses, supported Biafra. Some of them were, 4 in a way, indifferent to the whole thing. Like in the area of sales of arms; Britain sold arms to Nigeria at the beginning of the war. But, later on, pressure from the government made it impossible to continue sales of arms. As a result of that, Nigeria had to shift to the Soviet Union who, although they were perhaps not interested in Nigeria as Nigeria, they were very sympathetic to the Federal Government. In a way, they felt that the Federal Government had the right to suppress secession. AA: Will you please comment on the Nigerian economy before, during, and after the civil war. LO: Before the war, the economic situation was completely tied up with the elite group, the so-called, self-made, upper-upper classes. And during the civil war, I think I must praise the Nigerian economy because in spite of the fact a lot of money was used to buy arms and ammunition, they still were able to maintain some balance of payment. Immediately after the civil war, I think Nigerian economy has boomed in a way that has been almost unheard of in any other country in Africa. AA: Then to come to the main point, would you please tell me all you know about some of the most important events that took place during the civil war. LO: To me, the most important event was when the Federal troops decided it was a war and no longer a police action, so they decided to fight it as a war and decided to start capturing the towns that were occupied by the rebel forces. It started with Oguja, Calaber, Anogue, Ensoka, and clear up to Port Harcourt, before they took over Umoher and the rest of those places in the inner-most East Central State. So these were the highlights of the civil war, in my own opinion. AA: What do you think is the felling of the people in Nigeria when Ojukwu declared the state of Biafra? LO: The feelings were mixed. It depended on who you supported, and why you supported whoever you were supporting. For instance, the people who were supporting Ojukwu felt that they had a 5 chance to create a country of their own. Those who were not supporting him were unhappy about the situation. AA: We know that the Nigerian war became a military matter, but the same civilians took important parts during the civil war. Is there anything you can say about these people or do you know them well enough to talk about them? LO: Any civilian taking part in the military during the war, I don't think did so because of his own discretion. He was either appointed by the government or governments—either by the rebel government or the Federal Government. Or there was another group of civilians who felt that this was their chance to push themselves into politics to make money or to make a name for themselves during the event. AA: Does that mean that sane people were making money after the war? LIVI: Sure I a lot of people were making money during the war. In what aspect do you mean? AA: During the war, you know that Nigeria was spending a lot of money. This money they spent should have gone mainly to sponsor the soldiers and the ammunition and probably for rehabilitation of necessity. But I don't know how people could make money out of it as a civilian. LO: A civilian is given a responsibility; either to put up a special group or to supply food to the soldiers. In this case, it could present any amount of money he wants from the government. He could even make a lot more money than what he actually supplies because it was a case of emergency. When things are needed, they are needed at any cost at all. And the government wouldn't be interested in looking at the background of how the money came or where it came from—all they wanted was the things it bought at the time no matter what sort of price it was, they paid for it. There was money during the war, no doubt. Although the main trouble was how the money was distributed and what were the priorities to be considered for use of money during the war. 6 AA: Before the military take-over in Nigeria, as we can recollect, there were reports of tribalism, nepotism, bribery, and corruption on the government level. After the coup, history will have it where labor discontent continued where as those soldiers who were, through the government, promised to do something better or to better the condition of Nigeria. Do you think this is fact or just talk? LO: I think that in that case it is a fact. Bribery or corruption arises because of the economic condition and the social conditions in any given country. In the case of Nigeria, a lot of people look at things; they feel they want the, some of them are luxuries; most of them are not necessities. Some of them just don't make enough money to acquire those luxuries, so the only way they can have these is to get money outside their own salary, outside their own pay checks. And sometimes there is somebody who wants something badly enough and the only way they can get it is to pay some money so that the person who is in that area can do that thing as quickly as possible. In that case, you see, the receiver and the person who pays have mutual problems and it appears the only way to do this is to get money. I don't think the military government can simply wipe this out overnight. The only way to correct this sort of thing is a good distribution of money or people being paid adequately and a separation of unnecessary luxuries which is going too far in the country. AA: What affect does the war have on the Nigerian population? LO: Like any other war, many people have died. But then, at the same time, during the war, many people were born. So, I would say that the population is comparable. There might be some reduction in the number of people, but we don't have a recent census to compare to the one we had in 1962 or 1966. Until these figures come out, you can't actually say whether the war had a great effect on the population. Many people actually did die. Those who were sick have 7 recovered, and those who were born during the war are growing up. So we are actually waiting for the census of 1973 to see how the population stands. AA: How about the effect on property? LO: There is a great effect on property. A lot of people lost their money. AA: Do you mind commenting on the Federal Government’s efforts towards rehabilitation and reconstruction. LO: I think the Federal Government tried as much as possible to make those who lost something and those who were willing to start again do something for themselves. In the area of rehabilitation, I would say the effort has been excellent and nothing more than that. AA: To come back to another civilian we heard about, that is Chief Anthonoly Enahoro, in 1967 before the war started, he said, "As this chain of events begins and continues to build up at length no table talk can bring a unity and peace to Nigeria, but war," Would you please comment on Chief Enahoro's ideology in bringing peace and unity to Nigeria with war. LO: Enahoro made that statement as a result of the intransigents of Ojukwu and his clique. In fact, if I can remember, he made that statement after the peace talks in Ghana, in which Ojukwu bluntly refused to accept any of the conditions that the Federal Government gave to him at Oweri. In fact, at that time, the Federal Government had condescended to the level of accepting a confederation within the Nigerian regions, which in my own opinion, was fairly poor. Anybody who had wanted peace on table talks would have accepted those conditions. I think that it’s even better that he didn’t accept that condition because a confederation would not have been a good foray of government compared to the Federal State level that we have now. AA: Everybody is aware that all African countries depend on foreign powers for military aid. Do you mind telling me how the Nigerian and Biafran military governments received their military support? 8 LO: The Federal Government arms and ammunitions first came from Britain. And when they refused to supply them arms and ammunitions, they turned to the Soviet Union. Most of the arms and ammunitions for Biafra were bought on the black market, on the European black market, or the international black market, or whatever you want to call it. Some of them were crudely manufactured within Eastern Nigeria, then. AA: Which means that during the war, or before the war, the Biafrans were manufacturing their own ammunition? LO: No they didn't. At that time there were mainly three military areas corresponding with the regional capitals. There was a military set up in Lagos and in Caduna for the North and in Enugu for the East. So, precisely most of the soldiers who were stationed in Enugu, or soldiers of Eastern origin who were stationed in other areas of the country had some knowledge of how to manufacture arms and ammunitions. And at the heat of the war, most of these manufacturing centers were set up. AA: Can you compare the quality between those ammunitions manufactured in Nigeria with the foreign ones which the Biafrans used? LO: I would say the ones used by Biafrans made in Biafra were crude because they were rashly made. But even then they still had the pattern of the foreign ones they were using and they were trying to design their own to fit in exactly with the pattern they had from the foreign countries. The ones that the Federal Government was using were actually superb in lots of ways. AA: What lessons do Nigerians learn from this civil war? LO: I think they learned to accept defeat and try to look for a solution to defeat without resulting to conflicts. Above all, I think Nigeria has emerged a stronger country than it was before the civil war because every war teaches people lots of lessons. I think in the case of the Nigerian Civil War, the 9 area of foreign policy has been completely changed because of the events that various foreign governments played during the civil war. I think that Nigerians have now realized that there is a lot more strength in being one Nigeria than being divided. And I think that the twelve State structures has created chances for developments in the interior of Nigeria within these states than what it was when only the headquarters of the four regions actually developed. In ray own opinion, I think it was worth fighting the war because Nigeria has profited educationally and in almost all aspects from that war. AA: Most of the foreign papers that we read stated that the war was a war of religion. That is, the Christians in the South were trying to defend themselves from the hands of the Moslems in the North. Do you justify these sayings? LO: I can't justify it. I think it's stupidity. The people who wrote those things did not know about Nigeria, and besides it was a form of propaganda. They were perpetrated by Ojukwu himself, who thought himself a Christian. If you look at Nigeria, you have Christians both in the North and the South. And at the same time, you have Moslems both in the North and in the South. So it had absolutely nothing to do with religion. AA: Did Ojukwu have the support of his people before he seceded from Nigeria or did he secede on his own power as the military head of the Biafran Government? LO: He had the support of some, not all of the Easterners, if you want to say Easterners as a whole. But if you want to divide them into sections, tribes, or whatever, you want to call them, I think that outside the Ibos, all he had was phony support or mock support. But then, you've got to have in mind that it was a form of government in which everything was presented at gun point, so the only thing you could do was say that you support him even if you didn’t really support him. Even within the Ibos, not all of them supported him. 10 AA: What effort did those who didn't support him make to advise him not to continue with such a fight or secession? LO: It wasn't possible to walk up to Ojukwu and say I don't support you. I don't want you to carry on with secession. It wasn't possible at that time because you'd be killed instantly. The only thing that most of the people who didn't support him did was to smuggle themselves out of Eastern Nigeria. Some of them went to Lagos. In fact, it was these very people who actually led the Nigerian troops into Eastern Nigeria. Some of them crossed over to Lagos and joined the Federal troops in Lagos. From there they led the troops through Nigeria. AA: In 1966, in Ojukwu’s speech to a group of reporters, he said that Nigeria would never be a united country because of the different cultures in the four different regions of the country. What is your comment about Ojukwu’s statement? LO: That was Ojukwu's philosophy; not the philosophy shared by everybody. AA: Does that mean that he never had any support as far as such a speech is concerned? LO: If you were in Nigeria at that time, you would know that, his so-called advisors, his own Council of Consultative Assembly was not a consultative assembly. It was only a group he collected from various divisions and areas in Eastern Nigeria. And all he did was put them together and tell them what he wanted to do; not that he was asking than questions and seeking their opinions, he was actually telling them what he will do the next day. And what the people had to do was say, "Yes. We support you!” Of course, you had no alternative but to say that you support him. AA: Do you want to tell me that Ojukwu was really known to be violent? LO: He was violent depending on who you were. If you supported him, there was no violence, you enjoyed it with him. But if you didn't support him, or you showed any signs of not being with him then you must have been ready to face the consequences. 11 AA: How about Dr. Enudi Ezekui, who, in the first place, was one of Ojukwu's advisors and, later on, he disappointed Ojukwu by escaping from Biafra and didn't return? Do you feel he was a brave man and did the right thing? LO: Ezekui is a politician like every other politician who wants to maintain some sense of respect and stability. But like any other politician, who has some foresight, and looks at things squarely, you would think he was acting out of his own political instincts. When the game was running fine, like most other Ibos, or most other people in Eastern Nigeria who felt they could benefit immediately from Ojukwu's government, I think he had the right to support Ojukwu. Later on, after a full year, and a lot of setbacks, upon reconsideration, a lot of people decided that there was no hope that Ojukwu could win. That was when Ezekui switched over to the Nigerian side. I don't want to call him brave or a coward, but I think that he was merely acting out of his own political instincts. AA: One of the most important causes of the civil war was the twelve State structure proposal proposed by the Federal Military Government, in 1966. May I know, from your own opinion, whether the twelve State structure is a good thing for the country both at present and in the future. Or do you share in the opinion that it was one of the most important causes of the war? LO: Let me answer your first question. I think that the twelve State structures is a very sound thing for Nigeria. As of the moment nobody seems to know what the future will look like. But, at the moment, it is a very sound idea. Nigeria was long overdue for the twelve State structures, whether twelve States or whatever the number might have been at that time. You must remember that back in the 50’s, Alowawu, with his action group, got a lot of support from the non-followers of the then N.P.C. and the then N.C.N.C. simply because he was appealing to the minorities, the expensive minorities in 12 Nigeria. In fact, at that time they were talking about state division of Oguja and the River State in Eastern Nigeria. And then he had another follower in the middle belt when they were proposing to have a middle belt state. If you look at Nigeria, with its variations and the variety, I think that the state structure is a very sound thing to do. It should have been the best thing to have done at that time. There was always a need for states rather than a regional form of government which was taking place before the war. AA: Do you support mostly for Nigeria or would you rather see it in the present twelve states? LO: I don't know. I think in the South Eastern State, where I actually come from, I'm satisfied that it should be just that one South Eastern State comprised of the present provinces and the present divisions within the South Eastern State. I wouldn't be able to say absolutely that I'm right about the other states since I don't know their problems and I don't live in those states; I don't know what they're looking for. In my own overall judgment, I would say that the more you divide them, smaller and smaller, it may eventually get to the point where every communities, every clan, will look for a state. But you have got to have some reservations; in that certain states, like the West, have got certain problems right now. And some States are still large. I don't know what the Government may do about those States. But in the South Eastern State, I am very convinced that it should stay exactly the way it is because I am from there and I know what happens there. AA: Before the war started in 1967, the Nigerian and Biafran soldiers numbered only 11,000. But during the war, the number rose to about 200,000 soldiers. May I know how the Nigerian and Biafran governments got their boys to commit to this type of obligation? LO: In the case of Biafra, since I was then living in Biafra, there was almost an introduction of the draft system or being inducted into the army against your wish. I don't know what happened in the East Central region because where I was living was liberated when the Federal troops came in by 13 March of 1968. By then, Ojukwu and his gang had already fled to the East Central State. But before the Federal Government came there was almost a compulsory military service. That was the way they had intended to get more men into the army. Another way that may have made it possible to have more men in the army was that the army was the ruling power, at least in Biafra. It was the 'in' thing to belong to the army. It was the only way to be safe. Either you belonged to the army or you had someone related to you in the army to give you some form of protection in one way or another. And there were no other jobs. Schools were closed. There were no teachers. Trade was not running fine. And the only way to earn a living comfortably was to belong to the array where they had everything they wanted. In the case of the Nigerian array, the standard of living had been lifted in the army and conditions were made more attractive salary wise and living wise. So that actually made a lot of people feel like going into the army. AA: Considering all the suffering of the people during the war and the induction into the army of the boys, how many lives do you think the war really claimed? LO: I don't have any round figures; I don't have any figures at all. I don't have any idea. But I think many people died and many were wounded. AA: Who can be blamed for the cause of this horrible war? LO: Ojukwu. AA: What can you say in general about the present and future of Nigeria? LIVI: Nigeria as a result of the war and as a result of different things happening within the African continent, Nigeria has risen up to be a much stronger and viable nation now. In fact, the very fact that they won the war,—I wouldn't say they won because there was no victory and no conqueror and no one was suppressed. It was a question of a different of opinions and a difference of 14 ideologies—things have changed since then. And since they were able to pull out of that war successfully without foreign intervention or foreign mercenaries, (there were no actual mercenaries on the part of the Nigerian Government, but there were on the part of Biafra,) conditions in Nigeria are now better. They have a very bright future, because Nigeria is taking a respectable part in African affairs as well as the world affairs. Now that Nigeria can boast of oil, the eighth largest producer of oil in the whole world, economically it is stable. The only problem is that the money derived from this is not well distributed at the moment. On the whole, though, I think Nigeria has come up stronger and better than what it was before the war. AA: How did Ojukwu declare the state of Biafra? LO: Well, he said that he had held a lot of consultations with his own consultative assembly and that the government in Lagos was still insisting on not allowing the people of Eastern Nigeria to be free. So the only way to be safe was to pull out of the Federation. He had a reputation of making long, long, long talks on the radio. On one of those broadcasts he went to the Eastern Nigerian Broadcasting Service and declared Eastern Nigeria, Biafra, after the so-called consultation with his own consultative assembly. AA: What can you say about genocide as far as the war was concerned? LO: Well, it was a form of propaganda. You must understand that the propaganda of Ojukwu was handled by one of the world's best advertising companies. This was spread to appeal to the non-Nigerians or to appeal to people who were interested in the products—oil, and other things. There was no genocide; I didn't see any of it. It was only a form of propaganda. AA: After the war, what steps did the government take towards reconstruction and rehabilitation of the country? 15 LO: The first thing the government did was to grant unilateral amnesty to everybody who took part in the war. There were no prisoners of war. Immediately, food was flown into the Eastern State, the Central State, and River State. Then, most of the people from Eastern Nigeria who were working in Lagos or in the other areas were asked to return to Lagos and take back their jobs. The civil servants were paid, I think, a month's salary, even though they didn't have any form of job. Then yams and other foods to be planted were given to the people in the very poor areas so that they could start some sort of planting of crops. Then, food from the Red Cross was distributed in other areas. Schools were opened again, and many people became involved instead of just sitting back. There was a very effective form of rehabilitation. AA: How did the war end? LO: The war ended when the federal troops were almost entering into one of Ojukwu's enclaves in the middle of East Central State. Then Ojukwu fled to Ivory Coast and handed over the power to his own commander, Lt. Colonel Effiong. Effiong had his own consultation with the people who were in Eastern Nigeria. They felt that there was no other reason to fight; most of the towns and cities had been liberated; and they had about a twenty mile radius to govern. There was no sense in governing such an area, so they decided to surrender. They came to Lagos to lay down the surrendering paper to General Gowon. AA: What do you think would have happened if Nigeria had lost the war to Biafra? LO: Well, Biafra would have been a nation. But I don't think it would have been a very peaceful nation because they had a lot of internal problems which they didn't like to admit. And I think on the part of Nigeria, Northern Nigeria and Africa as a whole would have lost face in the entire international atmosphere because the O.A.U., as you must know, was actually supporting Nigeria. If Nigeria had failed, it meant that the O.A.U. would not have been as important as all of us estimated. So 16 with Nigeria winning the war, it has given a lot of psychological importance to the O.A.U. and independent African countries. They feel they can do their business without anybody intervening and deciding for them. AA: There was rumor, when the war was really hot, that the Nigerian Government wanted to change the capital city from Lagos to Caduna. What can you say about this? LO: I’m not very familiar with that rumor. I don't think that would have been possible. It’s not so possible to move the Federal capital because there are lots of things at Lagos right now which always remind people that it is the Federal capital. I don't think it could be done overnight. As I said, I'm not familiar with the rumor. AA: Do you support the military government ruling as long as they want, or do you want them to be there for only a certain length of time? LO: I think every military government is not a permanent government. It is only a government that comes occasionally. Nigeria has always been prepared for civilian rule. The area of military coups and counter coups arose out of a series of problems and at a time when the nation was at its lowest ebb. I think the federal Military Government, will eventually hand the power back to the civilians. According to Gowon, that will be in 1976. Since I'm not in Nigeria right now, I don't know whether or not it's a good idea for them to rule that long. But I know that eventually they'll hand it over to the civilians. If I were in Nigeria I would be able to comment more effectively on that. AA: We know that the Russian people helped Nigeria during the war most especially with ammunitions. Now that Nigeria won the war, will the government of Nigeria willingly sell herself to the Russians? LO: No, I don't think so. I think the Nigerian government, even before the Nigerian Civil War, had always tried to be neutral in the so-called East-West conflicts. I think they'll try as much as possible 17 to remain neutral simply. It's nice to trade with the Soviet Union; you can't just rely on the Western side which we have been forced to cling to them for such a long time because we didn1t have any alternative. I don't think Nigeria will sell itself to the Soviet Union, but I think it is very nice that Nigeria is able to have a respectable relation with the Soviet Union as well as having the same relation with the West. There's no need in being involved in the East-West struggle because Nigeria is a fairly new independent country. It's trying to stand up for itself and stand up for the welfare of Nigerians, and at the same time to be involved in the problems of Africa—the racism in South Africa and Rhodesia, in Mozambia, Angola, and even in Guiana. So these are the things that are first and foremost in the minds of most African rulers, and in the minds of the Nigerian politicians and in the minds of the Nigerian military men. They are interested in these—not the East-West struggle. So I don't think the Nigerian Government will be influenced or directed by the Russians. It is impossible at the moment. AA: Can Nigeria be as friendly to those countries who supported Biafra during the war as she was towards them before the war? LO: Yes. They are trying to. At the moment, concerning the four African countries that recognized Biafra in the heat of the war, Nigeria has opened diplomatic relations with them. Another thing, looking at the area of trade within West Africa where Nigeria is situated, you know we need some unified form of trade because Nigeria is, at the moment, quite productive and which they can give to these countries. There are African problems which can only be solved by unity, which I have already stated. At the moment, Nigeria is the leading most country in all the African States. So they have no alternative but to let bygones be bygones and start working out fresh policies which they are doing right now. It's possible that they will be very friendly. 18 AA: Before the war started, the Ibos went back to the Eastern region to fight for the State of Biafra. After the war, we were led to understand that they returned to other parts of Nigeria where they were living before. Were they well received or were there discouraging attitudes by those people in the North and West where they returned? LO: They were well received. I was in Lagos when the war ended and when the Ibos were coming back to Lagos. They had a lot of fears about coming. It was actually the Federal Government most of the manufacturing companies, and the Civil Service that invited those who had worked in Lagos to come back. The most important thing that you must note is that it was Northern Nigeria that it was said to have started the problem. Northern Nigeria was almost the first area to open their arras, and asked the Ibos to come back to Northern Nigeria. The only area in which there is a problem right now is the River State—they didn't allow most of the Ibos to come back. I think they must have good reasons for doing that. The Governor says that it's not going to be a permanent thing. It is only an effort to reorganize the State because the River State had the hardest effects from the Biafrans or the Ibos during the war. So, even though they couldn't go back, the money from their houses and personal affects has been sent to them, until the River State is able to reorganize, and then the Ibos will be admitted again. AA: What is your advice to make Nigeria a better place to live? LO: The main thing to do is to try to improve the economic conditions of the country, to make it possible for the average man on the street to benefit from the money that the country is now able to get from the oil and other products. Then, to improve the condition of education among the young people, either people should get a formal education or some form of technical education so that they will be able to fit into the existing conditions. And at the same time, to improve conditions in the local areas, within the village level which is lacking. It appears that they are going back to the 19 same old ideology of improving only the cities, caring for the people in the cities and the children in the cities. Whereas, the taxpayers in the villages who are working on the farms are not benefiting from the money that the Government is making. There should be some form of economy in which the layman in the local area has some benefit from the Government and some benefit from the fruits of the land. That is the main thing that should be done now, either by the Military Government or by the Civilian Government. AA: Would you like to see any changes in the government system? LO: I would like to see the civilians take over the government as soon as the Military Government deems them experienced to handle it. AA: How about the scholarship system in Nigeria? LO: I'm not familiar with the scholarship system, I'm a private student, as I have already told you. AA: At the moment, can you tell me if Nigerian resources are evenly distributed? LO: I don't think so. It is only distributed to the major towns and not to the villages. AA: Thank you very much. Your answers have been greatly appreciated. LO: You are quite welcome, Mr. Ademola. 20 SUMMARY AND ABSTRACT Oar underdeveloped nations are in a race with time, while they struggle to catch up with northern progress, mankind's oldest enemies do their damage now. Hunger and malnutrition kill 10,000 persons a day—mainly children—for life stunts their bodies and deadens their minds. This happens as a result of misunderstanding and the outbreak of wars. Needless diseases cripple and weaken many more as a result of poor nourishment and medical care. Skyrocketing of bribery, tribalism, nepotism and injustices doom young people and adults to a hopeless cycle of poverty. Suffering mounts. Unrest from power—hungry people spread, and the dream of peace explodes in war and turmoil. THE NIGERIAN CIVIL WAR 1967 —1970 INTRODUCTION All people in the world undoubtedly heard about the terrible Nigerian Civil War, "out only the "few" people who were in Nigeria during the war can say what was truth concerning the war. But yet, thousands of different news stories were published in the war newspapers. News articles were contradicting one another. It came to a point that the pro-Biafran factions were giving the news to favor Biafra while the pro-Nigerians were showing the world their angle—Nigeria was fighting the most honest war. Cries of genocide were ramparting all streets all over the world! I am like any other person who never had the opportunity to witness the war, but I depend on newspapers and "from mouth to mouth" news. I left my country, Nigeria, over ten years ago; and I have never been there since. I have to thank Weber State College for introducing this Oral History program in the college, and I will be failing in my duty if I do not express my gratitude to Dr. Richard Sadler, the director of the Oral History program. He has been taking much of his time to direct individual students. I know and realize that he has taken much of his personal time to attend to my call, both in his office and at home in order to guide me in my interview. This program is very advantageous to me in many ways. A few of them are as follows: 1. Academic improvement in general, for example. I have never conducted an interview with anyone before. 2. This interview gave me the opportunity of knowing the facts about the Nigerian Civil War. 3. It gave me the opportunity to know more about my country. Although the interview cost me almost a fortune, (since I had to make my way long distances to meet with those who actually got involved with the war,) I was happy to meet with people like Mr. Nzema Okeke from Eastern Nigeria. He used his talent as a political scientist to answer all my questions beyond my expectations. Baba Baro, from Northern Nigeria, did a wonderful job in my interview with him. And Yara Baba had done his best and as a non-citizen of Nigeria, out a Nigerian resident up until the end of the war, he had done a great job. I would like to thank Livy Owok, as a student at the University of Utah, for his help and co-operation in this interview. I was interested in his views. Now, I would like to extend my special appreciation to Olufemi Ijatula. Being the only female interviewee, I especially appreciated hearing the feminine side of the story, her views and opinions were extremely helpful. My thanks to them all. I am happy that people like these were present in Nigeria before, during, and after the war. I am proud and happy to say that this interview had been carefully carried out in a very fair manner without prejudiced mannerisms. I aid encourage the participants to feel free to say anything in their mind about what they witnessed. I assured them that whatever they did relate would not be counted against, them in any court of law. Once more, I am happy to see that the interview came to a successful end. The included pictures will also speak of themselves: "War is no good" by Ademola Adetula THE NIGERIAN CIVIL WAR 1967 — 1970 CONCLUSION Where does Nigeria go from here? Any Nigerian and Nigerian friends should be happy to see the end of the terrible Civil War fought in Nigeria in 1967 — 1970. Through my interview, anyone can realize that the war left behind remarkable and unforgettable events. It became a great concern to human kindness. The war left behind a wound that will take another generation to heal. Those who never lost their lives in Nigeria during the war blamed their creator for making them witness such fearful events. Heaven looked like Colden City to them. No one knew what the next hour and in stock for him, but always they anticipated when the world or the war would end. The war tore down not only unity and valuable properties, but also valuable lives. All my three interviewees confirmed, emphatically, that the war claimed about two million lives. This figure is more than the first and the second world wars claimed together. The break-up of Nigeria had been a terrible thing. But it is less than that cruel war. Thousands of innocent people were shot, bombed, or seeing their homes and livelihoods destroyed. Millions, including the children of Africa, were starving to death. Through my interview I could realize that mothing could be done about the suffering innocents since starvation was considered a legitimate war weapon against an enemy, and so Nigerians and Biafrans became another Britons and Germans in Hitler’s war. All Nigerians should be happy after the war because Nigeria will now nave the opportunity to build a strong nation of which every Nigerian- indeed, every African—can be proud. The Nigerian Civil War has much effect on the important progressive events of Nigeria. It has bad effects on: 1. Education and Skill. 2. Investment in Industry. 3. Industries 4. Medical Duty. 5. Agriculture 6. Unity and .friendship 7. Social Life. All of the above effects have, one way or the other, affected the progress of economic stability in Nigeria. To point out how the war affected the above things, let us start from the beginning. 1. Effect on Education and Skill. During the war, many schools and colleges were bombed and broken down. As schools and colleges became the target for bombs and cannons, parents were afraid of allowing their children to go to school. Students who lost their buildings had no other schools to go to. Ana throughout the wars two years, no school functioned well. That gave Nigerian educational progress a setback. 2. Effect on Investment. Because no one knew how the war would end, the well-to-do people refused to invest. So the Nigerian investment ended there. 3. Effect on Industries. Without any doubt, the important industries stopped production as the bombing started. Since management was not sure what the next minute would bring, a bullet or bomb, production was interrupted. Those who could have been working were either in the war front or hiding somewhere in the bush to save their lives. This poor condition forced the industries to close their doors. 4. Effect on Medical Duty. This particular effect extended throughout the country, mostly in the war zone. As bombs shattered the hospitals, doctors and nurses fled for their lives leaving the poor patients who could not get out of their beds. In the hospitals where bombs never dropped, the doctors were assigned to go and help the wounded soldiers in the war front, thereby, leaving the incapable nurses alone in the hospitals. 5. Effect on Agricultural products. This effect was by far the worst. The bombs that rained on the fertile land did a lot of damage to the land and the crops, Food production became short and thousands of people during the war lost their lives as a result of hunger. 6. Effect on Unity and Friendship. Without a doubt, as many people got hurt during the war, so it will take a long time to heal the wound of unity and friendship because the war left behind much mistrust among the people. 7. Effect on Social Life. This effect was remarkable. The evidence of this effect will mainly be on intermarriages among different tribes. I could recollect in 1967 when the war first broke out, some newsmen wrote that the loos, who were married to the Northerners, killed their wives and children; while the Hausas married to the loos also killed their families. Without any doubt, that event is enough to discourage intermarriage and other social life. POLITICS AND POOR LEADERSHIP: Now let us talk about politics and the poor management by the leaders. Up until the moment, Nigeria and other African countries still engage in what I can term to be "jungle politics." Any member of the opposition is an enemy of the reigning party. There is always outbreak of fighting during elections. "Turgs" are engaged to fight any opposing members, freedom of speech is taken from minority. This type of ugly scene happens all the time. For example, over a thousand lives and millions of dollars’ worth of property were lost in the 1963 election in Nigeria. Ana the same thing happened again in the 1965-66 election before the coup. Now the new style in Africa is the military over-throwing governments. This happens because every man is fighting for power rather than contributing to the progress of the nations in more honorable and honest ways. Stories of molestation of civilians by soldiers fly around every day. Armed robbery by men in uniforms of the Army is always reported. Tea-cup mutinies have been reported in convalescence centers, hospitals and pay offices. For example, Mushin in Lagos in Nigeria was the scene of a real-life tragedy of arson, rape and murder in an incident that featured men in army uniforms. After overthrowing the civilian government, many members of the Nigerian army went on a rampage of looting and rape. LAW: There has been continual political interference in the operation of government corporations on the personal level, with "jobs for the boys” playing a dominant role. But at the point where ministerial control should be most important—the point of financial accountability— it has been the most weak. The criminal action against fraudulent public officers in Nigeria is an equally weak reed. In Nigeria and any other parts of Africa, the opposition parties are either weak or non-existent; and it is plainly senseless to think that the ruling parties -will expose their own corruption. For example, in 1960, in a very rare demonstration of independence, Nigerian newspapers attacked the Minister of Aviation, Mbadiwe, for a particularly corrupt transaction. He was never prosecuted. Instead, the then Prime Minister Balewa permitted him to retain his ministerial posset, but made him return the plot to the land issue to the government. In the same government, when the Commission of Enquiry into trade malpractices reported fraud and profiteering by high government officials, the report as rewritten by a cabinet committee before it was released, to the public. All these types of misuse of government power have done a great damage to our nation. We need better law to protect the innocent people from these greedy political leaders so that there will be no internal war. We still have a long way to go unless there is a stop to all these ugly circumstances. To come to the last section of my conclusion, may I suggest that to succeed in reaching the mountain top of our national goal, Nigeria and even other parts of Africa must do the following things: 1. Search and empower the dedicated, modest, honest, and devoted leaders who submerge themselves in service to their nation and mankind. Leaders who abhor greed and detest vanity with great and outstanding integrity. 2. Learn, study, and understand the causes of our civil war. 3. Draw lessons from our difficulties. 4. Set on the task of solution to the problems. 5. Our political parties must adhere to truly national aspiration. 6. There must be substantial constitution to guard the innocents from the greedy and army officers. 7. More money must be spent on education and the system must be changed and great emphasis must be laid on vocational and technical aspects. 8. Foreign investors must be encouraged and exploitation must be discouraged. 9. Our agricultural policy should aim at self-sufficiency, thus giving our people an independent livelihood. Ana to achieve this, we must have agriculture in our school and university curriculum. Agricultural engineering should be introduced and strengthen our co-operative farming system. 10. More hospitals should be built and government provision for more doctors for the needed hospitals. All the hospitals should be fully equipped. 11. The government should pass laws prohibiting army take-over. If consideration is given to my above eleven suggestions, I am sure that Nigerian problems will take no time to solve and war will have no room.