Oral History Program Ora Jean Belnap Interviewed by John R. Sillito 26 August 2008 Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Ora Jean Belnap Interviewed by John R. Sillito University Archivist & Curator of Special Collections 26 August 2008 Copyright © 2011 by Weber State University, Stewart Library iii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. The working files, original recording, and archival copies are housed in the University Archives. Project Description The Weber State University Oral History Project began conducting interviews with key Weber State University faculty, administrators, staff and students, in Fall 2007. The program focuses primarily on obtaining a historical record of the school along with important developments since the school gained university status in 1990. The interviews explore the process of achieving university status, as well as major issues including accreditation, diversity, faculty governance, changes in leadership, curricular developments, etc. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management This work is the property of the Weber State University, Stewart Library Oral History Program. It may be used freely by individuals for research, teaching and personal use as long as this statement of availability is included in the text. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Belnap, Ora Jean, an oral history by John R. Sillito, 26 August 2008, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. Ora Jean Belnap 1980 Ora Jean Belnap Nursing Graduation 1967 Ora Jean Belnap and her husband Max Gilbert Belnap 2000 1 Abstract: This is an oral history interview with Ora Jean Belnap, conducted on August 26, 2008 by John Sillito. In this interview Mrs. Belnap discusses growing up in Weber County, her time at Weber State University when the institution was Weber College and her experiences with the Dee School of Nursing. JS: This is an oral interview recorded with Ora Jean Belnap in her home at 3655 Tyler Avenue, Ogden, Utah. The interviewer is John Sillito. Let’s start with a terribly ungallant question. I’d like to know when and where you were born. OJB: I was born in West Weber, Weber County, Utah. My birthday is January 20, 1927. JS: Tell me a little about your family and your growing up years. You say you were born in West Weber, is that where you lived? OJB: That’s where I lived in my growing up years. My father had a farm and he also sold insurance as a sideline. JS: Tell me your father’s name and your mother’s name. OJB: My father’s name was John Albert Heslop and my mother’s name was Laura Bell Hogge Heslop. JS: Were they born in West Weber also? OJB: My father and mother were both born in West Weber Utah. JS: Tell me about your father. OJB: I remember father used to make the soles of his shoes last longer. He used to resole them. They had strips of leather you could buy and when the soles were getting thin, he had a tool that he would cut the new sole out and then nail it on so that it would last longer. JS: He sounds like a pretty ingenious guy. 2 OJB: He was a good father. I think it was challenging to manage with nine children. They were thrifty, and found ways to save money, so we still had funds to do things. You didn’t have to go to the store to buy non-necessities. It was a good experience for all of us. JS: Did you have siblings? OJB: Yes. JS: Tell me about your siblings. OJB: I had six sisters who were all older than I. In other words, I was the seventh daughter and then I had two younger brothers. There’s Margaret, Lois, Ortell, Belva, Almira, Beth, and I (Ora Jean), and then my brothers Ivan and Orlyn. I also remember our house burned down. JS: Your house burned down? OJB: Yes. JS: Oh my. That must have been pretty traumatic. OJB: It was. Mother asked if anyone was hurt. When we answered no, she said then everything would be alright. JS: Tell me a little about your early years, going to school, where you went to school, and if there are particular memories about living in West Weber that you want to share that would be great as well. Where did you go to elementary school? OJB: West Weber Elementary School, and it was two miles away. JS: Did you walk? 3 OJB: No, at that time they gave bus rides to students over two miles away. And we were right on the edge, and so we walked about a half mile to the bus stop and then we met with the others that were near that area and we caught the bus there. JS: What kind of school was it? Were all the grades in one room? Or were there separate rooms? OJB: No, we had an upstairs and a downstairs. Elementary students were downstairs on the bottom floor and then the big kids were upstairs in junior high. JS: So it went through seventh grade? OJB: Actually it went through tenth grade until the year I started school and then they had them go to Weber High School. JS: So that’s where you went to high school in the tenth grade? OJB: Yes. JS: You attended that school from kindergarten until the time you were in ninth grade. What do you remember about it; particular teachers or activities? OJB: We started in first grade, and it was a combination of students from West Weber, West Warren, and Taylor. As I said we rode buses and we were on the edge, almost into West Warren. It was a brick school house. The first floor had elementary grades with two grades per classroom. The second floor had grades 7, 8, and 9. It was a good school; modern for its day. It had restrooms. The school had educated, qualified, caring teachers. It gave the opportunity to join with students in three communities so we got to know them well. JS: So it expanded your horizons in that way? OJB: Yes. 4 JS: You mentioned your dad had a farm and then he also sold insurance. Were most of the parents of the children in your school in those years farmers? OJB: Mostly farmers. JS: Well let’s talk a little about going on to high school. I’m assuming you went to Weber High? OJB: Yes. JS: And what years were you at Weber High? OJB: I started Weber High in tenth grade. They started having the tenth graders from our junior high attending high school in tenth grade, which I thought was kind of fun. I was there from 1942 to 1945 when I graduated. JS: That’s an interesting period to be in high school, and that’s what I am getting at. You were in your last years of junior high and high school during World War II. What do you recall about being a student during the war? Was it a topic that was frequently discussed among your classmates? OJB: Yes, to a degree because our classmates were leaving. Quite frequently we would see a male classmate come to school and he was dressed a military uniform. He would be leaving soon. Actually, I think the biggest difference was that we did go to high school sooner than the ones ahead of us had, and we also had an influx of a lot of the people who brought their families when they came here for work. JS: As part of the war industry, I see. OJB: So we met a lot of people who weren’t from our own little communities. JS: That must have been a change, because you were part of a small knit community, and now you have a high school that includes that group, but also new people. 5 OJB: Yes, and actually that was good for us. JS: How so? OJB: I think for one thing the students that went to Weber High were all from a little community, or two or three little communities, which resulted in knowing a lot more people than just our small community. The war made changes, and so we gained a new perspective with a larger high school. JS: And that there was a broader world out there. OJB: Yes. I was secretary of the tenth grade, and then the senior class. I was also on the yearbook staff. With the war, we had some difficulty getting supplies and paper to print a yearbook. They didn’t let us have much. It was more like a little pamphlet because of the war and paper shortage and all that sort of thing. JS: I forgot that there were shortages. So you were a senior class secretary. You were a class officer? OJB: Yes. JS: The other question I was going to ask you about that period relates to that. Were most of the class officers and the leaders in the school, despite the fact that you had a broader group of students,did the leadership tend to be from the group of students from the West Weber, West Warren area? OJB: No, actually for the most part most of the officers were from North Ogden and Pleasant View and South Ogden. JS: But not this new group of students? Particularly those that had come as result of the war? 6 OJB: They had been in the county schools, so it was a matter of meeting more county students. It was called Weber County High? JS: So it took in a broad geographic area? OJB: Yes, it was the high school for Weber County. Some of the towns that were represented in out high school were: West Weber, West Warren, Taylor, Plain City, Warren, Pleasant View, North Ogden, South Ogden, Washington Terrace, and the Valley schools which included Huntsville, and Eden. JS: Any recollections about your high school experience that stick in your head? Lots of social activities? OJB: No, not too many. For one thing, not many of the students were able to drive yet, and so we had basketball and football and dances but we didn’t have as many activities for that reason, but also for the reason that gas was rationed and there were a lot of things that we were very careful spending money on. JS: Sure. That’s interesting coming out of the depression and into the war. There was a lot of scarcity for a long period of time. You graduated in 1945. That would have been about the same time that the war was ending. That must have been a relief to everybody, particularly the young men in school who were facing military service. OJB: I was going to say that was one of the things I remember about high school was during some days they would point out and say so and so leaves for the service tomorrow. We hated to see them leave, but they did go that young and a lot of them went because they got school credit. But it was not easy to see all these young men going off to war. 7 JS: I’ll bet it wasn’t. Last question before we move on. Help me understand. Some of your siblings were old enough that they were not in high school with you, but were some still at your high school at the same time? OJB: No, I was the only one in high school. JS: So by the time you got to high school all your siblings were either younger or older. Alright let’s talk about your decision to go to Weber College, as it was then. Did you go immediately to Weber right out of high school? OJB: Yes. JS: Did you consider other schools? OJB: Not really. JS: What was it about Weber that attracted you? OJB: Well partly because we lived in Weber County and Weber College was the school for the whole county. We just thought Weber was neat and it was located in downtown Ogden. JS: So it was close. OJB: It was a convenient way to go to school. It had a good name, and so it was just kind of assumed that would be the way you’d go. Despite having that many children, I think there were maybe two out of the nine children that didn’t go to college. JS: I see. Even when you were in high school your siblings had moved on. By the time you got to Weber College were some of your siblings in school then or were you by yourself again? 8 OJB: I was by myself partly because there was the difference in age so that my two brothers were younger than I was. JS: So you were fortunate enough to kind of be on your own in high school and college in terms of not having siblings around. What did you major in at Weber? OJB: I think right at the start I took the ones you have to take. I think that was essentially what I did. JS: The generals, right. OJB: Actually, they had so many required things that I picked up classes in several different areas. So that’s essentially what I took at first. JS: It was a two year program then. So you spent your first year doing the requirements? OJB: Yes. JS: And then your second year you focused in on a degree in family life? OJB: Yes. JS: You started the fall after the war ended, were there students, boys particularly, who thought they were going in the army who all of a sudden found out they were in school? Was it a pretty good sized group of students that started that fall? OJB: As I recall it wasn’t a great number change. At least it didn’t feel like it as far as the students mingling. JS: Still pretty small. It was a real interesting period because for several years they didn’t have a yearbook. They had the yearbook in 1942 and then don’t start up again until 1947. So it was a pretty small school. OJB: It was. I worked on the yearbook committee. 9 JS: Oh did you? OJB: Yes, they didn’t let us have much. It was more like a little pamphlet because of the war and paper shortage and all that sort of thing. JS: When you were there Henry Aldous Dixon was president of Weber College? OJB: Yes. JS: Did you know President Dixon? OJB: I knew him as president. It wasn’t a personal thing. His daughter Ruth was attending Weber, and I knew her. She was the youngest. They lived in the house on campus. JS: There’s this sense about that period of time, of what Dixon called the “Weber Family.” He took a real interest in students. He tried to know them at least by name if not really personally, and would interact with them. Is that your recollection of the way things were around there? OJB: It was a pretty friendly school, but it was a transition time, so that you had more people from Hill Air Force base, and different defense plants, and that sort of thing. You had a lot more students, who didn’t know each other. We all just fit in, but it was a new situation. JS: Are there other things you remember about that time at Weber; a faculty member that you remember or an activity that is still strong in your memory? OJB: Memories about faculty- I recall Mr. Johnson who led orchestra. I really enjoyed playing the cello in the Weber College orchestra. Another activity that I still do remember was one that they had and I decided that wasn’t for me! JS: Which was? 10 OJB: They had a dance and the idea was that you were supposed to have a date and it was supposed to be seven girls to one man. JS: That didn’t appeal to you? OJB: No, I decided that if there weren’t enough boys to come to a dance let’s forget it. JS: Do something else. I guess that changed some after the war ended. OJB: Yes it did. JS: Any other things about that period that stick in your mind about Weber? OJB: I think the biggest thing was that we came to know the outside world a little better than when it was Weber County. JS: In high school? OJB: High school and college. JS: Was it in the classroom that you expanded your horizons or your interactions with different students? OJB: I think it was both. In high school we had many communities. It took a while to become acquainted with the increased number of students; plus many defense workers who moved into the area that were new to Utah and the culture. JS: So what you’re describing, starting first really in high school and then in college, were really expanding horizons, different kinds of people and a different kind of a world. OJB: When I was at Weber College I was part of the Whip Club. JS: Let’s talk about that for a minute. What was the Whip Club? OJB: Whip was like a graduated… JS: Pep club? 11 OJB: Pep club, yes. Actually we cheered at the games and that sort of thing, but we also were able to go to California to see a football game, which would have been impossible if we weren’t in Whip Club. I remember going to that football game in California. JS: Where in California do you remember? OJB: At Fullerton. JS: Let’s talk about that then. Let me make sure I understand it. The Whip Club was a club and not a sorority. Were you in a sorority also? OJB: We did have sororities and I did belong to the Kalamata sorority, but actually all that kind of activity was pushed down. JS: It was pretty low key? OJB: It was the kind of thing that the Whip Club and the sororities became more your social life. We didn’t have very much social life beyond that. JS: Right, that’s the picture I get of Weber during that time. You graduated in 1947 I gather and it sounds like you met your husband somewhere in that time. Let’s talk about that for a minute. Tell me his name, and was he a student also at Weber College? OJB: Yes, actually he was at that football game in Fullerton. His name was Max Gilbert Belnap, and he was from Hooper. So we went to the same high school but he was older than I was. He was in the army, so I got to see him when the Whip Club went to Fullerton, to the football game there, and he was on his way home from the army. I was amazed he showed up at the game. JS: So had you known him in high school? 12 OJB: Yes. JS: A little bit, although he was older. OJB: Yes. JS: So you started dating? OJB: We had written to each other when he was in the service? JS: Where was he in the army? I assume it was the army. OJB: Yes it was the army. He was a sergeant. JS: Was he overseas? OJB: Yes. JS: Where was he, Europe or the Pacific? OJB: The Pacific. In Korea. JS: You mentioned that he was from Hooper. Belnap is a name I associate with athletics, over the years. OJB: Those were mostly his cousins. JS: So he wasn’t involved in that? OJB: That one Belnap family was taller and more athletic and they just liked athletics. He was not as tall as a basketball player usually was, and his father needed help on the farm so he was there. JS: Tell us a little about when you got married. Was that after you graduated from Weber? OJB: Yes. He came home from the service and we dated. JS: Did he graduate from Weber also? 13 OJB: Yes he did. But it was awhile later, because he went to Arizona and built homes down there for awhile. JS: So did you get married here in Ogden? OJB: We got married in the Temple in Salt Lake. JS: Did you live here in Utah? OJB: Actually we moved to Moses Lake, Washington. We packed our gifts and belongings into a Nash car. It was a pretty good sized car. If the present was too big it just stayed at my parent’s house, but we drove to California and made visits to family on our honeymoon and journeyed up the coast to Washington. JS: How long were you in Moses Lake? OJB: About two years. My brother-in law and sister owned a motel up there which hadn’t been doing very good business. They needed someone to run it. We changed the motel into a profit making business and we were able to purchase some farm land in the area. The farm land would not be operable until the Grand Coulee Dam was finished. After we came back, he was doing electrical work. He learned the electrical work in the army. JS: But before he started teaching? OJB: Yes. He injured his back when he was doing electrical work and the doctor said you cannot do this any longer, so that’s when he had to go in a different direction. He started going to Weber College. He graduated in 1958 with an Associate of Science Degree. JS: Let’s talk about your nursing career. Now I want to make sure I have the chronology correct. You graduated from Weber in 1947, came back to Ogden in 14 1949, but didn’t begin nursing school until 1965. Help me understand what you had done between your first graduation from Weber and then your second graduation in 1967? OJB: Well actually, my husband eventually established his own electrical business. I managed the books and payroll along with caring for our home and family. JS: So when you came back to Ogden in 1949, were you mostly raising family? OJB: Yes. JS: When did you return to this area? OJB: Let’s see, Karen was born in 1949 in Ephrata, the county seat, near Moses Lake, and so it would be July of 1949 when we moved back to Utah. I remember Karen was a baby, and it was warm and we didn’t have air conditioning. So during part of our trip we stopped and sat under a tree and let the car cool off and get the baby to quit crying. JS: Let’s talk about your decision to become a nurse. If I understand correctly you have at least one sibling who was a nurse. Is that correct? OJB: I had two. JS: Which two siblings were nurses? OJB: My third sister, Ortell and the fifth sister, Almira. JS: What made you decide you wanted to become a nurse? OJB: I’m not quite sure, but I think the fact that they were. I thought that was pretty neat to be a nurse. JS: What do you remember about their experiences? 15 OJB: I remember that my sisters Almira & Ortell were in the early Dee nursing program and lived in an apartment building for the nurses. The home was exclusively for the nursing students. There were strict rules for the nurses who lived in the home. Their classes were in the hospital. When my sisters were in the program the family didn’t see very much of them. They were allowed to be out only one night of the weekend and had to be in by midnight because the door was locked at 10:00 p.m. Those who had a pass could come in at midnight. If they came after midnight with a pass they would not want to face the doorkeeper. It also seems like they had a pathway from the nurse’s home to the hospital so that didn’t have to go outside. My sisters were students, but also worked at the hospital. That was part of their training. I think they were paid $2.50 for a month or two weeks. JS: Let’s talk about your decision to become a nurse. Did you partially do it to supplement the family income because you had children that were going to college? Another thing, I believe you told me that before your mother died she was paralyzed and had a stroke and you helped to take care of her. So I wonder if that wasn’t some of it too? OJB: I don’t know. I admired the nursing profession. JS: I see. So there may have been some family--both immediate and extended-- reasons, but for you it was a profession you admired and you had that experience of having the two siblings who were nurses. So in any event, you decided then to go to nursing school at Weber and that was a two year program during that period of time. Were you working in a hospital or anything? 16 OJB: No. JS: So you would have been nearly forty when you entered Weber the second time. Tell me a little bit about that experience. How did that work? What was the program like? Was it mostly course work? Was it a combination of course work and practical work? This is fairly early in the Nursing program at Weber. OJB: Yes it was. JS: Tell me a little about how it worked. OJB: Actually we attended classes at Weber College as I recall, and then we also attended some classes at the hospital. Some of the Nursing faculty members I remember were: Helen Farr, Leola Davidson, Evelyn Yamaguchi, Sonia Parker and Ruth Swenson. These faculty members were knowledgeable, prepared, pleasant and helpful. JS: Was there resentment? Resentment may not be the right word but, did the nurses who had gone through a more regimented program see you as having an easier time? OJB: I’m not sure. I think probably more had the idea that they thought it was neat that my sisters were nurses also. I thought they were pretty neat sisters, because they were nurses! JS: You were a little older, perhaps, than most of the students. OJB: Yes, a little. JS: How did that work out? OJB: It worked out quite well. There were some who were older, not very many. I didn’t run into any difficulties. 17 JS: You didn’t feel uncomfortable? OJB: No. I remember taking a math class and thinking “What am I doing here?” I had six children, and was a little concerned, but when my report card came I said “Hey I did okay after all.” JS: Well, that’s still the case. Most everybody at Weber is still struggling with math. I used to hear that from nurses too! OJB: Actually when I went to school there the first time I didn’t worry that much about any of the classes. But when I went back, I mean, I was a bit concerned. JS: Well you’d been out of school a long period of time. You graduated then in 1967 from Weber. Did you graduate as an R.N. or an L.P.N.? OJB: R.N. JS: R.N. so it was a two year program. And then if I understand correctly you went to work at the Dee Hospital. OJB: Yes at the Dee. JS: Let’s talk about that for awhile. What was your specialty as a nurse? What area? Was it pediatrics or surgery or what? OJB: I did more in the maternity. I liked maternity. I think that’s probably because hey, I had all those children! JS: Knew all about that. OJB: I knew what I knew about it, but it was nice to have the nurse training too. JS: What was it like working at the Dee Hospital? Was it a fairly modern facility at that time or was it kind of struggling? What do you recall? 18 OJB: Actually I thought it was a pretty good facility, partly because it was a lot different than my sisters had experienced. JS: It had changed over time. OJB: It had changed considerably. JS: Were your sisters still at the Dee Hospital when you started? OJB: Almira wasn’t and Ortell did more private duty nursing. JS: So you were pretty much by yourself there. What about the students that you graduated with, did they go to work at the Dee Hospital? OJB: A lot of them did. JS: So in those days Weber provided a training program to staff the Dee Hospital? OJB: That was pretty much it. JS: You were at Dee during a pretty interesting period. Not long after you started there they moved to this new location and became McKay-Dee. What do you remember about that process or that period? OJB: I remember being excited about it. I remember thinking that we had a beautiful hospital. JS: It was very different. OJB: Yes. JS: Much more modern. So for you, the new hospital represented a more “state of the art” hospital closer to what you had experienced at Weber as a student, I’m assuming. OJB: It was. 19 JS: Let’s focus on your nursing career. You started there in 1967. Were you at McKay-Dee for your career as a nurse? OJB: Pretty much. JS: That lasted from around 1967 to about 1990, so about twenty-three years as a nurse there. Were you always in maternity during that period of time or did you move around? OJB: I moved around some. JS: I gather you would have seen a lot of changes between the time you began as a nurse and the time you ended. OJB: Yes. JS: If you had to point to one thing that changed the most dramatically, what would that one thing be? OJB: As far as nursing practices were concerned, my impression is that they had changed a lot of the things that were necessary for nursing. The other is I kind of felt that some of the early nursing practices had a lot to do with keeping a hospital clean and that sort of thing. I mean, not completely, but that was part of it and I figured we were there for nursing and not that. JS: So you’d seen a change that way? OJB: I felt it did. I don’t know how others would have felt. JS: But that was your impression? OJB: That was my impression. JS: Were most of the nurses you served with in that twenty-three year period also graduates of Weber? 20 OJB: Most of them. JS: So that feeding of nurses from Weber to Dee and then McKay-Dee continued during your period of time. Let me ask you another question. You might not know anything about it, and if you don’t just say I don’t know; what was the relationship between the nurses at McKay-Dee and the nurses at St. Benedict’s? OJB: I really don’t know that much about it. I think the relationship was good as far as far as personal contacts and everything. That was my impression, but I don’t know that much about whether or not some people preferred one place or the other as a place to work. JS: So you didn’t sense that? Because they are very different, many of the nurses at St. Benedict’s were also sisters of St. Benedict. My sense is that as the Dee School closed its nursing school and merged that into Weber’s school that is what cemented that relationship which produced the large number of nurses trained here who worked at Dee and then McKay-Dee. OJB: Yes. Js Did you tell me that you had some actual practical classes at the hospital as well as the course work itself at Weber State? OJB: We had certain times that our class was assigned over at the hospital. JS: So it was a blend of class room and practical. OJB: It was. JS: The other thing I wanted to ask you about, and we kind of got off the track, concerns your husband. You told me he had been in the military and you had the 21 motel up in Moses Lake and homesteading up there. But I gather he became a teacher. OJB: He did. JS: Tell me a little about his teaching career and how that worked. OJB: Okay. As I said, he hurt his back. We decided there was no way he was going to be a very good farmer or continue as a full-time electrician. Anyway he went back to school and got his bachelor’s degree. He’d graduated from Weber Junior College and then we moved to Logan and he went through the USU and this is when we had five children. JS: So you had six children but five during this period. And he graduated then from Logan? OJB: Yes, Utah State University. We rented a house that was close enough to walk to the university if our car broke down and he couldn’t drive. It worked out. That’s one of those things that I was grateful for. I think probably some must have thought, “What’s going on in their heads?” JS: Five kids and going back to school. OJB: But we rented this two story house with the idea that we would rent the upstairs apartment and then we’d be paying the same amount. That didn’t work out. We had some students. Sad to say they were from Ogden. I thought Ogden kids would be ok. JS: But it didn’t work out. OJB: Didn’t work out. They were there to play! 22 JS: After your husband graduated, then you came back here to Ogden, Weber County to teach? OJB: He came back to teach at Clearfield High School in Davis County. JS: What were his subjects? What did he teach? OJB: He taught math and electronics. He taught a little woodworking, but mostly It was when the school was new and they didn’t really have everything put together, everybody was teaching everything. So he covered quite a bit. But it was more electronics and that sort of thing. JS: Did he stay at Clearfield his teaching career? OJB: Yes. JS: It was all at Clearfield. So this would probably, I don’t want to put you on the spot on years, but I’m thinking this must have been the mid 1950’s he graduated and started teaching? OB: He went up to Utah State from 1959-1961, and then he started teaching at Clearfield High School from 1961 and continued there and finished his years in 1984 I think. JS: So more than twenty years. OB: Right. JS: But what you’re describing to me then is that for a period of time you’ve got your husband teaching school and you’re working as a nurse. That must have been a busy time. OJB: It was a busy time. Also during that same time Max attended San Jose State University in San Jose, California during the summers of 1963, 1964, and 1965. 23 We took all of the children with us those summers. There, he received his master’s degree. JS: From 1967 at least, until 1984 when he retired, and then 1990 when you stopped working you were both working full time. And I’m sure there must have been night shifts and different things. OJB: The night shift is when I worked. The rule was I had to be to work on the eleven to seven shift and so children had to be home by ten o’clock on a school nights. JS: Make sure you knew where they were before you went to your shift. OJB: Yes. JS: And you living here would be very convenient to where McKay-Dee was located. OJB: Yes. JS: Weber’s Nursing Program and the whole health professions has changed a lot. It’s always been strong, but in the period after you graduated it became much more specialized and harder to get into. OJB: I wasn’t sure if I was going to get into it. JS: Pretty competitive then too? OJB: It was. I applied and it was at the time when none of us were very sure it was a smart move. JS: When you say us, you mean your family? OJB: Yes. We weren’t sure if it really made sense or not. JS: Looking back on life it’s clearer than living through it, isn’t it? OJB: Yes. JS: I gather that you enjoyed your time as a nurse. 24 OJB: I did. JS: When you retired was it mostly that you had reached a point where you felt old enough to retire, or did you feel that the nursing profession had changed in such a way that you felt like it wasn’t what you wanted to do? OJB: Actually I worked until I was able to retire, then in 1990 we went on a church mission. JS: I see, and where did you go on that mission? OJB: Ohio Cleveland mission. JS: So you were on a two year mission in Ohio? OJB: No just one year. JS: And what did you do there on the mission? OJB: We went from door to door. JS: So it was actually proselytizing? OJB: It was proselytizing. JS: Well you’ve had an interesting life. OJB: We have. JS: You really have. You’ve come a long way from West Weber and you’ve seen the world. OJB: West Weber was a good place. JS: I’m not putting it down, but you saw a world outside it, and you’ve seen a lot of change. Is there anything that I haven’t asked you about your time at Weber College or your time as a nurse that you wish I would have asked that you think is important? 25 OJB: I think that the important thing is that nurses have gained a reputation that is better than when they started out with. It seemed to me that nurses were good people and they were good workers. JS: But it’s more professional. Well I think that’s a nice way to end the interview. I agree with you and I’m glad to have that on tape.