Oral History Program Joseph L. Bishop Interviewed by Harold C. Bateman 25 October 1972 Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Joseph L. Bishop Interviewed by Harold C. Bateman Emeritus Professor of History 25 October 1972 Copyright © 2012 by Weber State University, Stewart Library iii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. The working files, original recording, and archival copies are housed in the University Archives. Project Description The Weber State College Oral History Program was created in the early 1970s to “record and document, through personal reminiscences, the history, growth and development of Weber State College.” Through interviews with administrators, faculty and students, the program’s goal was to expand the documentary holdings on Weber State College and its predecessor entities. From 1970 to 1976, the program conducted some fifteen interviews, under the direction of, and generally conducted by Harold C. Bateman, an emeritus professor of history. In 1979, under the direction of archivist John Sillito, the program was reestablished and six interviews were conducted between 1979 and 1983. Additional interviews were conducted by members of the Weber State community. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management This work is the property of the Weber State University, Stewart Library Oral History Program. It may be used freely by individuals for research, teaching and personal use as long as this statement of availability is included in the text. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Bishop, Joseph L., an oral history by Harold C. Bateman, 25 October 1972, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. Joseph L. Bishop 1 Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Joseph L. Bishop (born 1932). Mr. Bishop served as president of Weber State College from 1972 to 1978. The interview was conducted on October 25, 1972 by Harold C. Bateman in order to gather President Bishop’s perspectives as the new president of Weber State College. HB: Prior to applying for the presidency of Weber State College, what did you know about the institution and it's history, Dr. Bishop? JB: Well, unfortunately, I didn't know as much as I would like to have known. I've been out of state for the last approximately 16 years working with colleges and universities across the nation. Weber has always been known for its fine athletic program. I had heard something about the School of Education—WILKIT program, but indepth knowledge of either of these programs or any other programs at Weber State College was not known to me at that time. HB: What prompted you to apply for the vacancy? JB: Well, I was asked to apply and it came at a critical period in our lives, my wife's and mine. We were reaching the point in our careers that we found it not compatable to continue to do the kinds of things in the career as it related to the personal goals we had in our lives. That is to say that I was flying around from college to college and university to university. I wasn't spending enough time at home with my family and we just decided that we didn't want to live that way and that we wanted to settle down and work at one institution. I wanted to be able to 2 go home at night and see the boys and my wife. I think it was a personal kind of thing that prompted us to look at Weber State College. HB: During your visits to Ogden what were your impressions of the city and the general area? JB: Well, I must confess that I had, in my youth, developed an attitude toward Weber, not towards Weber, but towards Ogden that wasn't really true. We had heard a great deal about 25th Street, as I recall when I was a young boy, and the evils that took place in the area. So I had always thought that Ogden was a relatively wild town, and I can say that we were just pleased as we could be to find out that the contrary is exactly true. It's a fine place to live, the people here have much support for the college, in fact I don't know of any place I have ever been that had more support for the college than in Ogden. The people are genuinely true, honest and hard working people and we are just delighted with the area. We want to stay here and raise our family here. HB: It seems that your experiences were very similar to my own. When I left Logan people felt very sorry for me to know I was coming to Ogden. All they could think of was 25th Street. Well, what were your initial impressions of the Institutional Council and the Higher Board of Education? JB: My initial impression of both the Institutional and the Higher Board was one of admiration. We have some very fine people serving on both boards. I was somewhat concerned about the role definition between the Institutional Council and the Board of Higher Education, or the Higher Board as it was referred to, but I think that is working out very well. There seems to be a role definition that 3 tacitly, if not implicitly, keeps the thing working very, very smoothly. We need the advantages of both and I think it is working out very well. I'm very pleased with it. HB: What were your early impressions of the administration and the faculty that you met at Weber State? JB: Well, I was impressed then and I must confess I still am. There is a great dedication on the part of the faculty throughout the total institution. They are concerned and dedicated to the welfare of individual students. As you know, at some institutions, people look at their employment—I'm speaking now of the teaching role—as a job and here they look at their role as a mission. They are very concerned about the welfare of each student. I'm very impressed with that kind of attitude. As far as their academic credibility, I think that's comparable to any other institution around at the same level, so I'm very happy with that. President Miller is a very fine dedicated man. He's dedicated 19 years of service to this institution and I haven't met anyone that didn't admire what he has done and I admire him personally. HB: I certainly think, Dr. Bishop, that you have been well received by the people of this area and also certainly at Weber State College. I am in a position to know because I have made it a point to contact many people on campus and you certainly have made a very fine start. What are your impressions of the campus and the physical plant and the college in general? JB: We do have a challenge ahead of us as it relates to financing. We need to improve our instruction, improve the interest of the students and yet at the same time decrease our costs and up our space utilization, so that's the challenge 4 ahead of us. I was very pleased to have the second phase of the library receive the go-ahead and we'll soon have all the buildings in and I think we are set up for the next few years. I'm not too concerned about our space as it relates to the academic facilities. We are interested, of course, in moving ahead with the special assembly center which would take care of many of the very special programs we have as well as the athletic programs. That is a dire need, and I think the community is behind that and also the students, so we are anxious to move ahead on that. As a matter of record we received approval yesterday from the Higher Board to request that the State Building Board hire an architect to give us some help in the planning phases of that and our hope is that we'll start construction in about two years. HB: I think it probably is appropriate at this time, if you'd give some information concerning your wife. I understand she majored in business education at Brigham Young University for her BA degree and I wondered if she minored in music? I understand that she is a very accomplished musician. JB: My wife, Carolyn, was in the Brigham Young University Program Bureau for a number of years. In fact their trio the Deltone Trio, won the small group award four years in a row while at Brigham Young University. She's a delightful singer, entertainer and at the BYU Homecoming this last year the trio was invited to come back and sing again at their "Fieldhouse Frolics." It was just 20 years ago that she started there as a freshman, so that was a delightful occasion for her. We have five sons. The oldest is Gregory age 14, then Robert age 12, Michael age 10, Steven age 8, and Scott age 5. We wish we had a little girl, but we don't 5 so we'll just keep the boys, I suppose. Let's see, what else, you asked about Carolyn's academic training, she did receive a bachelor's degree in business education from Brigham Young University, continued her training at colleges and universities about every place we have gone and she holds the equivalency of a master's degree, she gained that while in California. She has taught at Brigham Young High School, an experimental school group in Provo, Utah, and she has also taught at Imperial Valley College in California and evening school and this kind of program probably at every institution we have been in. HB: I heard one of your boys play the piano some weeks ago and I judge he is a very talented pianist. I believe he was playing Franz Liszt’s Hungarian Rhapsody in a rather professional manner. What is this boy's name? JB: This is Robert, he is our second son and he does rather well. He also plays trombone. It might be of interest to you. Gregory, our oldest son, plays the piano, reads rather well and he plays the saxophone and Robert plays the piano and trombone and Michael plays the piano and is now taking trumpet lessons. We do enjoy music. I guess that is what I am saying. My wife plays the organ and piano, sings and it is just fun for our family nights to sit around the piano and all sing together, we do enjoy music. HB: Would you please outline your past professional administration experience with positions held in California, in Chicago, I believe you were in Haiti too, and in Florida and any other places where you were located. JB: Yes, upon graduation from Brigham Young University I was not particularly convinced at that time that I had found my niche in life. I had majored in 6 language—that is to say in Spanish and French foreign language. So with a master's degree I decided that it would be appropriate to go out and teach for awhile and see if I liked that aspect of it. I graduated from Brigham Young University with a master's degree, in 1959, and taught a year of high school in Hayward, California. The name of the high school was Sunset High School. I then took a job as a foreign language instructor at Imperial Valley College and stayed there for two years and received a grant from the U.S. government to go to Haiti. I went as the Dean of Instruction to that small college, but by virtue of a lot of things that happened I ended up being president. The president left earlier, so it left two of us there in charge and we were made co-directors—my friend and I. He had a death in the family and he left. So by virtue of that, I ended up as the president and we were there for a year. Then I was Academic Dean or Dean of Instruction, I'm not certain of the title, at Mt. San Jacinto College in Hemet, California, and while I was there I completed my doctorate work at Claremont Graduate School and University Center. I was at Mt. San Jacinto College for four years and then I took a position as Vice President of Prarie State College in the Chicago area. I was there two years and then I was executive director of a group of ten community colleges for the 70's which really ended up 30 colleges. Now I was with GT 70's. It is a consortia, something similar to the old farmer's co-op of grouping together to do things of mutual interest. The group did grow from ten colleges to thirty colleges and universities before I left them. I was with GT 70 for about four years when I received a call asking if I would be interested in applying for the position of President of Weber State College. 7 HB: Now Dr. Bishop what place or function do you think that Weber State College should play in Utah higher education in relation to the University of Utah, Utah State University, Brigham Young University and the other state colleges and private colleges within the state? JB: I think we have a unique situation here in the state. The University of Utah has a particular role related more to graduate education as does Utah State University. My sincere desire is to make Weber State College the best four year institution, not only in the state, but to have a national reputation as it relates to instruction. In other words, I think our focus should be on quality education—teaching as opposed to research. I'm certain that if we reach our first goal then by virtue of effort we will become a university. I'm not rushing that. I'm not concerned that we become a university. We have two fine universities in the state. I would direct my attention and the attention of others to making this the best four year college that exists and I think that's our goal for the present time. HB: Concerning the liberal arts, what do you think? What emphasis should be given to the general education here at Weber? JB: Well, that can be a loaded question. Let me see, if I can just briefly give some of my philosophy of education. My feeling is that we should zero in on the student. For example, the word education itself, if you trace that back to the Greek "Educari" means to lead out of and I take that literally to mean to lead out of the student his potential. So our task therefore is to examine carefully the student's needs and project with him what those needs might be in the future, and then try and provide avenues of assistance to assist him in reaching his potential. If we 8 find that he is interested in and has talent for the vocational or technical areas then we should develop that school and those programs for him, and the same manner if we find that his talents are more compatable with the liberal arts, then we certainly should go that way. What I'm suggesting is that we maintain a very comprehensive role at Weber State College, so that we do supply the needs of the students. In my judgement it is indeed important that all students have a liberal, or a general education, that relates to the humanistic things of life as well as the technical, as I say, that sometimes is misunderstood. That’s why I think we should rely upon our analysis of what student needs are and then focus on those things. HB: I did my advanced degree in general education, actually in the social sciences, but I think it has been the philosophy of Weber over a long period of time that the student should have a broad general education before he specializes, and I appreciate your point of view here. Then I have noted over a long period of time, that certain groups—and I'm speaking not of Weber State College now, I'm speaking for myself—have wanted to maintain a very strong technical image, institute image, here at Weber State College. We, of course, as you already know, have quite a demand here for the liberal arts and also the technical education and I believe that we have things pretty well balanced and I believe they are pretty well accepted by the faculty on the campus. I don't think one element is fighting the other here. JB: That's true. HB: What are your views concerning technical education emphasis? 9 JB: Well, once again I think Weber State College is rather unique in that a student can attend Weber State College and receive his basic or general education and he can try several fields of interest and transfer from one to another so that there isn't the stigma attached to becoming a student in the vocational or technical areas that is evident and visible in some universities. We believe that vocational or technical education is just as valuable to that student as is the general or the liberal education. So we are concerned that he have that opportunity at all times. Certainly, we have a fine vocational technical school here. I'm very proud of that. HB: Yes, I think we certainly have and I recall President Dixon, who preceeded Dr. Miller as president of the college, saying many times that at Weber it is our intention to teach a student to live a life as well as make a living. What do you think the responsiblilities of Weber are concerning pre-professional education? JB: I guess what I'm saying with all of this is that I'm trying not to make that categorization—vocational-technical education versus the pre-professional—but rather to keep focusing on the students needs and then supply avenues of assistance for him. We do have adequate programs and curricula for the preprofessional as it is now referred to, in some years that title may change, of course, so the basic assumption is that the thing that does not change the student and his needs and that is why I'd like to focus on that. HB: I believe that's the wiser course because there are groups in the state that are latching upon these particular phrases and they make them into mole hills and your approach to this problem is sound. I think it will get the most for Weber in 10 the long run. Do you think we should continue the strong community college image it enjoyed during its junior college days? JB: Well, if you mean by the question, should we continue to serve the community in every way we possibly can, I think the answer is a definite yes. We do have a committment to the community. We try to be comprehensive as much as we possibly can. For example, the first football game of this season we had over 16,000 people turn out and, of course, that stadium was representative of both students and community. There are a lot of services that we do provide for the community—the arts, the theatre, the athletics and many other programs. So yes, we do have a committment to the community and I think we should continue that. HB: What, in your opinion, should be the basic educational philosophy of Weber State College? I think by what you have said, you have already answered that in part in what you have already stated. JB: Yes, I think so. Our committment is to be comprehersive, to serve the needs of the students and serve the community. Outside of that I have also indicated that, at the present time, I don't think it is our role to be doing a lot of advanced research. By that I am talking now of graduate research program level. HB: I think in some of the public pronouncements you made some comments concerning the obligations that the college has to the student or the schools have to students and obligation of the faculty to the student as well as to the college. Would you care to comment on that any further? 11 JB: Well we're always concerned not to loose sight of our "raison d'etre." We are here for the student. If we take away the student, of course, none of us would be employed. Everything we do is for the student as it relates to the academic program, of course. Now we do have other kinds of services we render to the community, but without the students those services would also disappear. So it is essential that we continually focus on the student. That's the way we should set our performance indicators to see if we are serving him and that's the way we'll know whether we are successful or not. HB: What part should the students play in the administration of the college? JB: In terms of educational management, as you look at the goals and priorities of the institution, it would be ludicrous to establish goals and priorities with consideration of the students who are the recipients of any goal or any priority that we establish, so the students should have strong input, as should faculty, and the community, so we don't exclude them in any way, to the contrary, I want as much participation as we establish those goals as we possibly can have. That I think is very appropriate. HB: I wondered if the students are participating in the Administrative Council meetings? JB: We have student interaction at all levels and we want to increase that, for example we had a retreat this last year, this last summer, I should say, wherein we increased the number of student representatives up to about twenty percent of the total population in that conference. So about twenty percent of those at that conference were students and we did speak there, address ourselves to the 12 issue of our goals for the coming year and our priorities and they did have a great deal of influence as we drafted those goals. HB: Are the students represented in the Academic Council as yet? JB: Are you referring to the Academic Council on campus? HB: Yes. JB: We have two student representatives that are indeed officially represented in that council and they have voting privileges.