Oral History Program Mae F. H. Glynn Interviewed by Deborah M. George 20 November 2013 Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Mae F. H. Glynn Interviewed by Deborah M. George 20 November 2013 Copyright © 2014 by Weber State University, Stewart Library Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. The working files, original recording, and archival copies are housed in the University Archives. Project Description The New Zion Community Advocates worked with community members age 80 years and older to have contributed to the history of Ogden city. The interviews looked at the legacy of the interviewees through armed services, work, social life, church, NAACP and educational systems in an environment where their culture was not predominant. This program has received funding from the Utah Humanities Council and the Utah Division of State history. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management This work is the property of the Weber State University, Stewart Library Oral History Program. It may be used freely by individuals for research, teaching and personal use as long as this statement of availability is included in the text. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Glynn, Mae F. H., an oral history by Deborah M. George, 20 November 2013, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, Special Collections, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. iii Mae Glynn, photo taken at her home on November 20, 2013 The Anytimers Social and Civic Club 1st Annual Formal September 25, 1964 at the Ben Lomond Motor Hotel The Anytimers Social and Civic Club 2nd Annual Formal September 24, 1965 at the Ben Lomond Motor Hotel Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Mae Glynn conducted on November 20, 2013 by Deborah George. DG: I’m Debbie George. I’ll be interviewing Mae Glynn to tell us a little bit about her history and how she came to be in Ogden. My first question for you is tell me your name and birth date. MG: My name is Mae Glynn. I was born August 12, 1927 in a little town called Chandler, Oklahoma. We moved from Chandler to Crescent, Oklahoma and that’s where I grew up and went to school. I had a lot of schoolmates; I had a lot of fun. We all played and had a good time together and then after I grew up I moved to California. I was very young when I got married and my husband was a welder for the shipyards in California during the war. DG: Sure MG: He was a welder in California and when the war ended we came back to Oklahoma. I didn’t want to come back because I was trying to stay away from the farm. I grew up on a farm and we were very poor. So we came back to Oklahoma and he wanted to farm. At first he bought a team of horses with the money he had saved up and he tried it by himself. Rented some land, that turned out fairly good. MG: We went with the share croppers and we tried that and we didn’t like the way it was going so that’s why we decided to come to Utah. At that time my father had moved here and he worked at Hill Air Force Base. We were on our way to Yacamo, Washington and we stopped in Utah to visit my dad, but during that 1 time the railroad was booming. My husband went to work for the railroad. That’s how I got to Ogden, Utah and I’ve been here ever since. DG: So tell me what are some of the important lessons you’ve learned in life? MG: The important lessons I’ve learned in life is growing up being an adult, raising a family and how to get along with people, how to get along with your neighbors to be a good neighbor. Love one another and I’ve learned to stay in the church because I feel like religion has a lot to do with my life and I feel like I’ve accomplished a lot in life by raising five children. I have five children that grew up here in Ogden, went to school here in Ogden. Each one of them has graduated from high school and went to college. Ogden is good place to raise children. I feel like it was a great place to raise children. So during the time when my kids were in school I went to work here in Utah right after my husband went to work for the railroad. I worked at a little store called Diane Hughes at that time they would only let black people get a job in shipping and receiving. I could press clothes and unpack the boxes, you’d sort out the clothes and hang them on the racks and take them out to be sold. The ones that we didn’t sell sometimes I’d have to pack them up and ship them to another store. I would undress the mannequins in the windows and do the windows. I did that for 10 years at Diane Hughes. That was the name of the store that was downtown in Ogden. Then I went to work for Grayson’s and I worked there for three years doing the same thing. I went to Anita’s shop and worked there for three years doing the same thing. 2 Then I ventured out, I went to Marquardt and I worked there as a machine operator and I made airplane parts. I did that for 3 ½ years and so during this time I was trying to get a job at Community Action. At that time we had a program called Community Action and they was allowing the blacks to go to work and just about everybody could get a job there, but me. So I kept trying and I went to the employment office, the guy says well I’ll tell you what I think you’re going to like this job better because this will be a desk job and so he says you want to put in for it? I said sure so I put in for this job. I thought oh boy what am I getting into now? I filled out this application and then I got this call from the state capitol in Salt Lake City stating that I had to come in and take this test. I didn’t know what the test was about, I was nervous and frightened and I said oh well who cares I’ll just do the best I can. I went there and looked for a place to park and I parked. I found this place and I strutted in and they handed me these papers and I said oh my gosh what am I going to do with these? I looked them over and I took this test. Then when I took the test I said oh well. I didn’t know how I did on the test but I turned the paper in. So after the test I went back to Marquardt and continued to work. I didn’t let on like I put in for another job, I’m going to have a job before I quit my job. I scored real high on this test, I got a 99 on the test and I don’t know how I did it. I was the number one on this job to get hired. I turned it down the first year because it wasn’t going to pay me the money that I was making at Marquardt. So the next year I was still on the register and they called me and I went to work for the employment office. They called it a job developer, I worked on the 3 Welfare Intervention Program (WIN), it was something special that they had for the welfare people. We were trying to get as many welfare people off the program as possible. My job was to develop job opening for a specific welfare clients by writing, telephoning, and visiting employers. I’d contact employers for the purpose of promoting job openings and familiarize them with JTPA, Tax Credits, JT, and Job Services. I also had to interview clients and to determine appropriate placement activities, then instruct the clients on proper methods of attaining and retaining employment. I would work with employers to find qualified applicants. A lot of jobs and we what we called a WIN contract. We would set up these contracts and if somebody would hire this person they could work for them for three months and just pay them their salary and stuff and we would pay them to pay the people. It was a contract and after the contract if they hired this person then we would get credit for it and they would have a job. I got a lot of girls on at Hill Air Force Base. I worked there for 23 years. I retired, the year I retired I was 65 years old at that time and since that time I’ve just been busy doing other things in the community, working around in the church and helping with my grandchildren. DG: What is one of the proudest moments in your life? MG: Gee I’ve been so proud of everything in my life. I feel proud of what I’ve accomplished in life because during the time I worked for job service I got to go back to school. I went to school at Ben Lomond High and graduated from Ben Lomond High. Then I could go to Weber State College and get credits while I was working. I accomplished my education was one thing I was proud of 4 because after having five children and them growing up and I’m trying to work and take care of them during the time they’re growing up. That was quite an accomplishment I did, I think it was anyway. DG: So how long have you lived in Ogden? MG: Been here for 60 years DG: So in 1954 we’re in 2013, okay. That’s a long time, long time. So how has Ogden changed over the years? MG: It’s changed a lot. We rented first when we first came to Utah and then when we tried to buy a property a black person couldn’t live any further than Lincoln Avenue. We couldn’t even go up on Grant. When they were showing us houses they showed us a lot on Wall Avenue and I didn’t like Wall Avenue so I ended up buying a place on Lincoln Avenue. That was as far as we were allowed to buy. DG: The other question I have, what do you miss most about the way it used to be? In Ogden? MG: I don’t miss a lot. To me it has improved so that I’m satisfied here. I wouldn’t go back to live in Oklahoma. DG: Who are some of the characters, from here that you remember? MG: Now that’s one I can’t answer. I don’t remember the great characters. DG: Do you remember any stories or legends about Ogden? MG: No I don’t have any stories about Ogden. Ogden has been good to me and I’m very appreciative that it being a place where we can raise children. It’s a great 5 place for that. I wouldn’t take anything for it. I have seven grandchildren and I have eleven great-grandchildren and I have eleven great great grandchildren DG: That is great. Did you have a nickname growing up? MG: No DG: No nicknames, okay. MG: Well I did too have a nickname growing up in California. During that time we jitter bugged and they called me jitter bug. My neighbors that was just the neighbors nobody else ever called me that before, but that was my nickname in California. None of my brothers ever, they always called me Mae or sis. DG: Who are your best friends? MG: Who are my best friends? DG: Uh huh. Who were or who are your best friends in Ogden, as you were in Ogden and what were they like? MG: My best friends are my church people now. I used to have a neighbor named Mrs. Harrison and she was my best friend because she was special. She worked at Hill Air Force Base. She’d say come on girl let’s go fishing. We’d go fishing on the weekend and I really enjoyed that. I like to fish. When I was growing up I would fish a lot as a kid. I used to hunt when I was a kid. My brother taught me how to shoot a rifle, that was the fun part. Oh we could shoot those squirrels and rabbits you know. Back when I grew up you could eat a squirrel and a rabbit too and so after I grew up and I was a grown woman in my own backyard I saw this snake. I’m afraid of snakes so I ran got the shotgun and I thought I could kill this snake, but nobody taught me that a shotgun would knock you down. I shot this 6 snake and my heels went straight up in the air. I don’t know what happened to the snake. The snake took off and I ended up laying on the ground. He could’ve bit me. DG: But you survived it. MG: I survived it. DG: So besides fishing what else did you do for fun? MG: What else did I do for fun? We used to go to these formal dances that we used to have. I have pictures of those. That was the most fun thing we had during that time. This was an occasion they had about 3 different clubs, but I can’t remember the names. When I first came to Utah the very first month I was invited to a formal and this went on for years and years. During that time Joe McQueen had his band and we would have live music, that was a very good thing that we had in our lives. We had a lot of dances at the Ben Lomond Hotel. DG: Yes Ben Lomond MG: Yes these are the pictures here. This is the entire social civics club. These are the ones that I have pictures of. I was a member of that, at one time I was the president of it. DG: So can we have scans of those as well? MG: You can if you want too. You’ll have to do that. DG: I think you told us how you met your husband. He was a welder. MG: I met my husband in Crescent, Oklahoma before I went to California. I met him in school. I was in the grade school and he was in the high school and I had real long beautiful hair. Oh it was long, my braids was long enough that I sat on them. 7 These two little girls locked me in a closet were about to cut my hair off and I was screaming and hollering and my husband which he wasn’t even a friend then. I didn’t even know him. He and his girlfriend were walking down the hall, heard me hollering and they came in and stopped the girls, that’s how I meant him. From then on we were good friends. DG: So you were talking about grade school, high school. What are some of your favorite memories there? MG: In high school, in grade school. In grade school I had a lot of friends that I grew up with. Another family that had I think it was nine of them in family. It was two girls and I played with the girl was my same age. We played all the time together. We jumped rope, played hide and go seek. Played jacks, tic tac toe. DG: What about high school? What’s one of your best memories from high school? MG: My best memories in high school was at the Ben Lomond High School. We did that at night and there wasn’t many memories but Ms. Macown went to school with me, Bonnie Macown. When I graduated I had to make a speech because I was working at job service. My legs were just shaking, but I made it. DG: Okay you weren’t in the military. MG: No. DG: But your husband was. How did that impact you while he was away doing or did he do any service or was he mainly state side? MG: He retired from the military. 8 DG: So what lessons did you learn from this time in your life? Being out here in Ogden. MG: Well I learned a lot of lessons. I learned to keep to myself, not interfere with other people’s business. Mind my own business and I’ve always had good neighbors. Like where I live now the winter months, if they see me out there trying to get the snow off they’ll run me back in the house. My neighbors take good care of me. I have good friends and good neighbors in my neighborhood. I’ve had that all over Utah, everywhere I’ve ever lived. I’ve never had a problem with neighbor and I feel like if you can get along with all your neighbors in life you’re doing good. DG: Is there anything else you want to tell us that we didn’t cover? MG: I don’t think so. DG: You don’t think so? Well you have a lot of, you said you didn’t think you had a lot to tell us, but you’ve told us quite a bit. MG: When I grew up we didn’t have electricity. We didn’t have running water. We had toilets, outdoor toilets when I was a little kid growing up. When I came to Utah that was quite an excitement, but even before I left Oklahoma we did have the running water and we did have the toilets inside. When I was a kid we had this wood stove that we cooked on and it had a big water tank on the side of it and that’s how we would heat the bath water. When momma would get ready to wash we always would build a fire around a big black pot in the yard to wash the clothes. We had to use a washboard, but as I grew up we found and got these gas washing machines. You could put gas in them and it had a motor and it 9 would start up. It went choo choo choo choo, wash your clothes. It had a ring on it and you run over to the tub and rinse your clothes then hang them up. Then we finally got kerosene stoves. But we had been living pretty modern during the time before I came here. DG: Well alright we appreciate you taking the time to tell us a little bit because we learned a lot. MG: I didn’t know what I was getting into, but I did it. DG: It’s great and we appreciate you taking the time to share some of the highlights of your life with us now. 10