Oral History Program Estrella Beltran Interviewed by Sarah Tooker 20 April 2019 Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Estrella Beltran Interviewed by Sarah Tooker 20 April 2019 Copyright © 2022 by Weber State University, Stewart Library iii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. The working files, original recording, and archival copies are housed in the University Archives. Project Description The Beyond Suffrage Project was initiated to examine the impact women have had on northern Utah. Weber State University explored and documented women past and present who have influenced the history of the community, the development of education, and are bringing the area forward for the next generation. The project looked at how the 19th Amendment gave women a voice and representation, and was the catalyst for the way women became involved in the progress of the local area. The project examines the 50 years (1870-1920) before the amendment, the decades to follow and how women are making history today. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management This work is the property of the Weber State University, Stewart Library Oral History Program. It may be used freely by individuals for research, teaching and personal use as long as this statement of availability is included in the text. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Beltran, Estrella, an oral history by Sarah Tooker, 20 April 2019, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. Estrella and Martin Beltran 20 April 2019 1 Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Estrella Beltran, conducted on April 20, 2019, in the Stewart Library, by Sarah Tooker. Estrella discusses her life, her memories, and the impact of the 19th Amendment. Alyssa Kammerman, the video technician, and Martin Beltran are also present during this interview. EB: But yeah, so if you go now to Puerto Rico, people after Maria have been affected. ST: Okay. EB: In good and bad, right? Major tragedies like that will affect. So, they are more back to what I remember before, where neighbors will sit together and because of the necessity, there is no power, there was no water, so they knew things were going to get bad. They put everything out of their homes. They opened a barbeque, and everybody let’s say, this apartment building that has six apartments, we will sit together outside because it was so hot. I brought the meat, I brought the rice, whatever it was. They would just get together. My sister told me that for the first time, she met everybody in her building. ST: Wow. How long has she lived in her building? MB: Years. EB: Over ten years. Yeah. Over ten years. ST: Wow. 2 EB: That’s what I remember for Puerto Rico before I left in 1994. That everybody knew everybody. My kids were your kids. Then they turned to be a little bit more Americanized. So, they were living their own separate life and after Hurricane Maria that just didn’t work anymore. We needed to work together. Then the kindness of other people that came and helped them. For example, Utah has, “Light Up, Puerto Rico”. That’s through the Lieutenant Governor and friends of ours. Still to this day, we have people from Utah going to help build. So, Puerto Ricans go back to be humble and accepting the help and be more together. There’s a lot that still has to be done but it has changed because we went after the hurricane. It was devastating to see how the island, the whole topography, everything… ST: Just totally changed. EB: Totally changed. But the people went back to their beginnings and that’s really nice. Like my sister will say, “I just sat outside and for the first time, I stared up at the stars.” But because there was no MB: Light. EB: Electricity. So, the night, that was their light, the stars. I said, “Enjoy it.” MB: They went from all of these, “I’m on my own, I do what I have to do.” And they went back to appreciate each other, appreciate their neighbors, appreciate family and even appreciate nature. EB: Yeah because the island is known for their greens, right? Once the hurricane passed by, it looked like it was torched. Everything was gone, trees had no 3 leaves, nothing, not even our rainforest. To see that coming back again, and to see how they have survived, and the nature reminds them, “We can spread out again. We can do this again.” It really helped. It really helped them. We went for my mother’s funeral in March of last year and I was like, “Wow, yes. This is my people. This is what I remember.” That we are all family and we kind of are all related too. So, it’s just more together. It’s really good. ST: So, it’s a very bad, good thing. EB: Yes, it is actually—let me tell you, those almost two weeks that I had no communication with Puerto Rico, my mother was over 80 there with my sister. We knew she was ill; my worst fears were that she had passed away and we couldn’t do anything. That was hard. That was really hard. It was hard to go to church and not have anybody ask me, “Hey, how’s your family in Puerto Rico?” Come on, it was all over the news. ST: Yeah. EB: And then when I was losing hope, I felt so like, nobody cares. We were sitting in Olive Garden because I said to him, “I can’t, take me out.” We were not being… I couldn’t even function. He says, “Okay, let’s go for salad and soup.” He had an Ogden High t-shirt and an older lady passed by—very witty, I love the way she looked and the way she was. She says, “Hey, I’m an Ogden High Alumni, are you?” He goes, “Oh no, I just work for Ogden High.” And then she says, “Where are you guys originally from?” Right away, I knew she was really smart because 4 usually they say, “Where did you learn your English?” And I have to say, “Same way as you did. In school?” ST: Oh my. People really say those things? MB: Oh yeah. EB: “What part of Mexico are you from?” MB: No, somebody asks you, “What are you?” EB: “What are you?” That’s a story I’ll tell you. So, when she said that. When she said that, I knew immediately, “This is an educated Utahn.” When she said, “Where you guys originally from?” And we said, “Puerto Rico.” Like in a choir, we said it together. And she goes, “I’ve been praying how to help. What are you guys doing?” So, we talked about, “Light Up Puerto Rico” we talked about making sunshine boxes, the post office has a $20 box, whatever you put in there is always $19.99. We were sending sunshine boxes and we have families from our friends that were decorating the inside and putting rice, beans… MB: Batteries… EB: Whatever. MB: Soup… EB: Straws to clear the water, special things, and she goes, “You are the answer to my prayer, I’m going to give you money.” And we were like, you know, profiling Latinos that won’t take money. We were like, “Don’t give us money, we can give you the link to, ‘Light Up Puerto Rico’”. She goes, “No. This is where I stop here. 5 I want to send boxes, sunshine boxes. You put in there whatever you want.” And she pulls money, and I’m like… MB: She went like this, she just… ST: She just has it in her… MB: This money and hands it. EB: I think it was like $60. I said, “Oh, this is going to buy what goes in the box and also sending it.” Because some people will adopt a box from me and just pay for the shipping. But I said to her, “This will fill the box and also…” She goes, “Yes, please, oh thank you.” And she left and in the middle of Olive Garden [makes crying noise] because I was losing hope because not even my coworkers… and I was like, “Hello? This is difficult.” We just stick to ourselves. But that woman just gave me hope again and that’s when the Lieutenant Governor went to Puerto Rico with our group of “Light Up Puerto Rico” with Jorge Alvarado and Cari Lu Alvarado and from there, we have been helping and Utahns have been helping. It’s very helpful. MB: You know Utahns have been helping a lot. ST: Good. EB: Yes, they have answered the call. ST: Good. EB: Yes, we are very appreciative and that we still have people like—just this spring break, we have youth and parents to help because we are still building roofs, we 6 are still cleaning. Especially, the inside towns of the island and the mountains that are so not reachable, right? Their resources are less. So, we still have a lot to do but yeah. It gave me hope again… ST: Good. EB: In humanity. ST: Yeah, because I couldn’t even imagine—I haven’t ever gone anything like that. There’s been other things that I’ve gone through but nothing like, you know, that devastating, because I grew up here in Ogden. EB: And it’s really hard that the daily task of just getting water was too much. MB: My sister-in-law will go early in the morning, and pray, “Please help me find ice. Let me find ice.” Because for the insulin. EB: Insulin. MB: Insulin, “Please let me find it.” Sometimes she will wait in a long line for two hours and then when she was just so close, the ice would run out. So, you know… but she was able to find at least a little bit because again, neighbors helping neighbors. So, this neighbor was able to find a bag, was able to get a bag of ice, and they share it with everybody. EB: They share it with everybody. MB: So, they will be able to. And this is what happened, you know? “I have all of this meat, and if we don’t eat it, it’s going to go bad. So, I’m going to cook the meat, but if you’re families send you rice, like with the sunshine boxes, we send 20 or 7 15 pounds of rice.” Because we like rice! They will be so happy. And if you have an electric stove, you cannot cook, but if you have a gas stove, then we… “I’m going to cook the meat but you’re going to have to cook it in that house and that other person will have to cook the rice and the community will come.” That’s what it came out to, the community coming together. The neighbors getting to know each other again. That’s why—when we went to her mom’s funeral, it was… EB: It was the same. MB: Again, the interest for each other as… EB: Human interaction and caring. MB: Yeah. EB: Even though we were strangers, you know because we stayed in a hotel. I’m like, “They’re treating us like I remember, like we’ve known each other forever.” Yeah, you could see their kindness and also hope. Hope that they can be better. But it has been a major event. ST: I bet. EB: Major event. MB: Years in the process to recuperate and still there is a lot to do. EB: And we are so glad that Lin-Manuel Miranda brought hamilton down to Puerto Rico, that opened the door for saying, “We are open for business.” Because 8 Puerto Rico lives out of the tourism. Other famous people that had come and say it… [To Martin] What was the name of chief? MB: Andres, from Spain. EB: He’s from Spain. ST: Yeah, he has a cooking show. MB: Yes. EB: Yes. MB: A lot of people don’t know that also that you know, Elon Musk, Tesla, they were one of the first ones to respond and within weeks—I think it was two weeks, the Children’s Hospital was up and running. They all of these, they put all of these solar panels and batteries, so the hospital was running during the day with the solar panel energy. The energy from those batteries let it run during the night. A lot of people don’t know that Tesla was one of the… EB: One of the first ones… ST: I had no idea. MB: One of the first ones in the world. EB: Yeah. ST: Because they are kind of high end. EB: Yeah. 9 ST: You hear things every once in a while, about high-end companies, but that’s wonderful that they helped. EB: They did. They did. MB: JetBlue. EB: JetBlue was amazing. MB: JetBlue…like flying supplies. EB: For us, like from here from Utah, they will not charge. ST: Oh, that’s wonderful. EB: I mean. That was… MB: All of these big companies… EB: All of these big companies that did help. MB: That’s why—like right now, we could get flights to Puerto Rico for cheaper, but we are going to stick with JetBlue. It was maybe $200 more for the two of us, but we are going to stick to JetBlue because they were there, and they still are. EB: And they flew… the first ones to fly patients—I got my mother out also through a special that they had because they were moving out elderly people with a lot of medical conditions. As soon as they got up in the air, they were the first one or two flights out. MB: The world responded. 10 EB: Well, part of the world. Not everybody responded the same way we wanted but that’s okay, we don’t need everybody. The people that were there, did help. But we are open for business and I love Hamilton. I see you’ve got a poster there. When Hamilton came in and it really is a whole production, but it brought a lot of people in. A lot of people and they were like, “Okay, let’s support.” Because that’s what they live from, tourism. ST: Yes. EB: Because it’s beautiful. MB: And rum. ST: And rum. EB: The United States consumes most of the rum produced in Puerto Rico, not any other country—the United States. ST: Well and it will keep people employed. EB: Yes, yes! We love it. Keep going. ST: Okay, my name is Sarah Tooker, I am here with Alyssa Kammerman and Estrella Beltrán, EB: Yes. ST: And her husband… MB: Martin Beltrán 11 ST: And we are doing an interview for the Women 2020 History Project. Okay, so Estrella—hopefully, I’m not very good at rolling my… EB: You’re doing it perfect. ST: So, what is your full name? EB: So, I’m going to tell you my maiden name. ST: Yes. EB: Estrella Díaz Ramírez ST: Okay. EB: Because we don’t take away our mother’s last name, so we have two last names. Now that I’m married, and when we moved here, I changed to Estrella Beltrán, I usually use a, “D”, in the middle just to distinguish that I’m still a Diaz. Legally, I’m Estrella Beltrán, but I was born Estrella Díaz Ramírez. ST: Okay, and what are your parents’ full names? EB: My father’s full name is, Luis Díaz Martinez and my mother is Brunilda Ramírez Alustiza. ST: That’s beautiful. EB: I know, very Spaniard. MB: It’s a mouthful. EB: Yes. ST: And when were you born? 12 EB: I was born January 27, 1966. ST: Okay, and where? EB: Ponce, Puerto Rico. ST: Did you grow up there? EB: Yes, all of my life until this dude took me out. Until, 1994. ST: Okay. EB: December 13th I arrived here. Horrible snow, I’m like, “I’m going to kill you.” ST: Yeah, from there to here in December, I’m sure it was quite a shock. Do you have any fond memories about your childhood, before you went and started going to school? EB: Yes, and it sounds odd, but I have fond memories playing in a funeral home. ST: Okay. EB: This guy was like a foster grandparent to me. He was friends with my parents. He owned a funeral home and I still remember his name was Oscar González, and the funeral home was González, Funeraria González and it was on a main road in Ponce. So, the funeral home was a huge house on this corner and then you crossed the street where they prepared the bodies, and everything was on the other side and it was a one level building. But the funeral home had two levels, I think, or three. Anyway, my parents—I was attached to my father’s leg. That I can remember. So, my father would go visit, they are talking over there and I see bodies and it doesn’t bother me. 13 People were coming out and they will bring people covered and it wasn’t anything that I was scared of. That guy loved me. I remember the first little tea set that was porcelain given to me was by him. We would walk back and things like that and so my first funny memory about that was I think I was probably four or five and my father was firefighter. A guy from the crew had passed away somehow, I don’t know. I just know that I arrived with parents to the house because that was the viewing of the person, they used to do that in Puerto Rico back then. I walk in and I look at the guy and said very loudly, “Hey! I remember this guy! He was in Grandpa Oscar’s Funeral Home! He was hanging from the thing!” And my father was like… and my mom just, “I remember gently.” Not. She pulled me by my arm and took me out. For me, at that time, I didn’t realize “Oh, death, oh….” For me, they were sleeping or whatever. But I remember my mom talking to me. So, in my head, as a little kid, I remember that as a fond memory because I stunned adults. You know what I’m saying? Everybody was like, “Oh my goodness, what is she saying? She saw him?” In my head, as a kid, for me that was funny that all of the adults… you know I said something I didn’t know back then that was, but everybody was. “Oh there was a reaction, I guess.” My mom could not enter the home again. Yeah, we sat in the car until my father was ready. So that’s my first—and that was the joke, I mean we came home, and I’m the fifth of six. My three older siblings are one after the other. There’s a period and then there’s my brother between almost five years in between and then there’s my little sister, there’s ten years in between. So, my 14 older siblings were more like parent figures too because they were older than me. They told everybody, family meetings, “Do you know what she said?” And I’m there, “yeah!” You know what I’m saying? It was the funniest memory I have before school. I know… ST: Well when you are a child, you don’t have a filter. You don’t understand. EB: [To Martin] Don’t say anything. ST: And sometimes as an adult we still don’t have filters. MB: Exactly. EB: But you know, a kid, a fifth of sixth, receiving all of that attention, you imagine now, and I can see it. Every gathering, “You know what she did?” ST: Lots of attention. EB: Yes. It was very funny. ST: Where did you go to elementary school? EB: So, I started preschool in a little community. Back then, it was not a Head Start. It was the beginnings of Head Start, I’m pretty sure. But it was in a very low-income community. My mother was a teacher and it was close to her school. So, she would drop me there, so I had their preschool and then I went to kindergarten Jamie L Drew that was a school in my town. My mother was a teacher there, a fifth grade. That’s where I went to kindergarten, but I only stayed for a little bit in kindergarten. They moved me to first grade because I think the teacher was ready to send me away. I already knew how to read, I was 15 writing, I knew—my mom was a teacher, and I had been in preschool. So, they quickly moved me to first grade, so I went from Señora Santana, I still remember her, to Miss Ubides That was an old old cute lady. She was my first-grade teacher. ST: Do you have any fond memories—you speak about your teachers; do you have any other fond memories of elementary school in those times? EB: I had really good teachers now that I look back. They were very caring teachers. For some reason, in my mind they all look old. I don’t know why, but they were older. When I now go to schools, and I look at teachers, I’m like, “These are kids teaching kids.” But when I was a little girl, I remember that most of my teachers were old. Miss Ubides was really really old. She was the darnest funny, the education was so different back then, right? There was corporal punishment. I received a lot. MB: For not having filters. EB: Yes. I will say that the thing that I remember the most. Back then I didn’t understand which was very present in my family, was the respect to United States. I remember that on Fridays we would do the pledge of allegiance, we would sing the anthem, and that was the day that we would bring like ironed clothes and we would have to wear our bow ties. Everyone was in their best uniform, during the week you could have part of the uniform. But on Fridays, there was a big assembly and the school’s in Puerto Rico are all open. So, there was a courtyard. They’re open, but they usually look like a semi-circle or an oval. 16 So, the courtyard—the recess for kids is inside because the teachers look from their doors out. Instead of in here, where the doors lead to the outside and the recess is around the outside of the school. Puerto Rico is in. ST: It’s contained. EB: Contained. So, I remember on Friday’s we would do that. We would also sing the Puerto Rico anthem and then it was like installed in us. Like this is what we do. We are both. We are Puerto Ricans, but we also owe allegiance to the United States. MB: Because we are born U.S. citizens. EB: Yes, but as a kid you don’t know that. I didn’t realize that and the importance of that until I moved to Utah and also when I went on my mission to Uruguay. The military parties would stop and ask me for my passport. “Oh, so you are not a Latina?” and I was like, “Yeah.” “Well you have a U.S. Passport?” “Not from my doing.” Then when I moved to Utah too. It’s like people will ask me, like I had a principal once ask me, “Do you have permission to work?” And I said, “You know what I get up every morning and I look at the mirror in the bathroom and I say, ‘You want to go to work today?’ and the lady on the other side says, ‘Yep!’ and that’s how I get permission to come.” ST: That’s a really good answer. I might use that answer sometime. But yes, I understand. See, and to me, you say these things that people have said to you and it just blows me away because I don’t think like that. 17 EB: I know, but there’s people that still do. So, I learned, that instead of taking it personal. I want to educate, so let’s educate them. Or catch them in their stupidity. I came here, we had nothing. Nothing. We had a box of toys for my two-year-old. I was five months pregnant, right? Nothing but clothes. That’s it. And I went to work for Walmart and as you know in Walmart, you don’t have a job description. They don’t have unions. You do everything. So, I’m working in the men’s department and this manager comes to me and says, “How comfortable are you with the U.S. currency?” And I went, “Ding!” Just caught him in his stupidity. “I’m not, I’m sorry. You want me to cashier?! Oh my gosh, no. I can’t.” “It’s okay, we don’t want to put you in an uncomfortable position.” “Thank you.” I don’t know any other thing, Puerto Rico is all the U.S. dollars, “In God we Trust.” But he didn’t know. That’s not my problem, that’s his problem. ST: Oh my. But you are right on. That’s clever. EB: That’s all I’m saying. And because I know that, when I have an ASL student or I have a teacher asking me, I say, “Be careful.” Because yes, there are moments that we don’t get it. Especially, idioms and things that are regional, but other times we bank on that. So, learn to distinguish one from the other one because that’s an advantage that we have. Yeah, with me they can’t because I’ll go, “Oh come on. You see everybody getting up? You get up to.” You know, so yeah. So that’s what I remember the most about my… and I had a blessed time because I was a teacher’s daughter, so nobody messed with me. Kids knew and teachers knew, and my mother was very protective. So yeah, the best time was when she went on maternity leave when I was in fifth grade, to have my sister, oh 18 my gosh, not having her there. Best time of my life. Best time. I did everything you can imagine, and they wouldn’t tell her because she was on maternity leave. They’re not going to bother her. ST: Because she’s delicate. EB: Yes! Don’t give her stress. I had teachers give me everything from doughnuts to paddles, but yeah, the best time. ST: Now would it be middle school or junior high? EB: We called it middle school. ST: Middle school. EB: Over there. So, you have to understand that all the schools were very close to my community. So, we were not considered upper-class, but we were working high. Because my father worked for the federal government as a firefighter at the naval base—Fort Allen. We had a little bit more of a status, right? But around us, there were lower-income families. So, I went to school with them and I loved it because I was not allowed to do in my home, I was allowed to do in their homes. The middle school was less than a mile from house, I will say, not even a quarter. MB: It was very close. EB: Again, there’s a little bit more freedom because they know my mom was a teacher and my father was a very well-known firefighter. But it’s middle school and she’s not, there right? So that was the first time in that school that I had an 19 African American—Afro-Latino teacher for Spanish. I realized that I had some resistant tendencies that were taught at home that I didn’t know until I had that teacher. That I was like, “Wait a minute, at my house we don’t listen to that music.” Or “Nope, we don’t watch those shows.” He would put things into my head to think. I loved him. Mr. Castro. We got to a relationship where he would just tell me flat out, “Nope. That what you are saying is racist.” Because I was not recognizing that. And I was like, “Oh wait a minute, what?” Right? I remembered that was my first fight in middle school was with a girl named Marilyn. We were in line and she said, to me, in Spanish of course, “You’re racist.” And I just turned around and beat the living out her. Because I was not racist. You know what I’m saying? In my head, I wasn’t. I was called to the office. Yes, it was my fault, I was the one that you know, created the whole thing. He came in and advocated for me. I remember saying to the Principal, well this is going to be lovely when we call my parents here and we will have to explain to him that I’m racist because of him. So, this is going to be a lovely conversation, go ahead call him. Of course, they didn’t. So, nobody knew that I fought. MB: Her dad was a very white man, blue eyes. EB: But that was taught to him too. So, he had no problem interacting or helping. He always said, “The problem is when you get mixed with my people.” But that was how my grandma was. ST: Yes, that’s understandable. 20 EB: He will tell me things, “I had my first girlfriend and she was darker.” My mom chased me with a knife when she found out. I ran. So, I learned, ‘Nope that’s not what I’m going to do if I want to live.” When we look at my ancestry, they own slaves. So, it was in the past, but it was not until, at least my generation in my house, my siblings that were like, “No we are going to stop this.” This is not something we are going to do. But it was that teacher Mr. Castro that made me realize, “That’s not how everybody thinks.” I remember him saying, “Here, touch my hair.” And I was like, “Oh…” Because I had never. He was such a forward teacher, it was more than just Spanish, what he taught me. Then I went to high school, right around the corner. All of this is walking distance, so nobody gets dropped off, there’s no school busses, this is a community where you have upper-middle class middle and low together. The high class goes to English schools that are private. That’s usually how it was in my time. It was right there, and these are the same people that I grew up with and you know, that we have been going together through the majority. But then when you got to high school, you have from other elementary schools that feed to the high school and there’s the clashes and all of that. By then, I realize—now that I have my daughter I see it too when she was trying to find herself. Who I was going to be, right? You start thinking about what’s going to be your future. I had great friends, but I was the only LDS in my group of friends. That’s very odd in Puerto Rico because most of the people are Catholics and even if they are not, they say they are because they go for Easter, Christmas. MB: Yes. 21 EB: [To Martin] What else? Easter, Christmas, weddings. MB: Very specific religious holidays. ST: They don’t go every Sunday and do all of these things, they go when they are servicing. EB: No, so yeah, they are Catholics. But it was odd because, well you know there was mean comments and there was some bullying that back then you didn’t call it bullying. Like for example, the prom dance was on a Sunday, so I didn’t go. My friends didn’t understand. My parents wouldn’t compromise. It was difficult. It was very difficult to be LDS in an only place where you are the only one and you get pointed at. I got offered alcohol for free because they wanted to see, “Oh, let’s see if the Mormon girl drinks.” Drugs—it was really easy for me to say no. It was like, “No, I don’t want to do that.” I had a teacher in high school, Señora Castro, she was again, a Spanish teacher that I learned… now that I see it, but at the moment, I said, “This is a clever teacher.” Because instead of us reading novels and write reports, or having us take tests, she would say, “Choose a novel, create a play, create a song, give me a visual in 3D figure, whatever it is.” I was like, “What? Will we take tests?” She goes, “No.” “Can we do it alone or groups?” She says, “Oh I prefer groups if you do it in a play because a one-person play is kind of boring, but you decide.” And I’m like, “Oh my gosh.” And we entered that class, we hardly sat. We would go outside in the hallways and prepare because we were so loud. In my mind, I was like, “Free.” Because I had always hated those seats. 22 So when Señora Castro said that we were like, “Oh my gosh.” I think I read most of my novels from the Latino literature in that class than in any other class. This was 11th grade because we did it, we finish, we present it, and “Can we do another one?” Now as a teacher I go, “Yes! That’s what education is” right? It was amazing, that woman… and she was also a neighbor. Now I’m thinking me as a teacher, “I don’t want to see kids during the weekend.” But we went to her house, she was neighbors with Georgie. MB: I know, two or three houses down. EB: Yeah, and I would just, “Hey! Mrs. Castro!” Because we called them that, we were so Americanized, instead of Señora, it’s Mrs. or Miss. MB: But you know with that teacher—because even with all of the kids, every time they saw her, and Georgie, he is five years younger than her. You would see the kids year, after year and they would react to her the same way. EB: And he wasn’t a student of hers but because he visited his best friend that were neighbors, he got to know her. MB: And she was darling even in the neighborhood. EB: And we would go, “Hey!” and she would always take time to talk to you. And I graduated and I still go say hi to her. And it was so incredible. Then I decided that’s what I want to do. I remember writing her a note—I will never forget her reaction. It was the end of the year with her, and I wrote a note and I said, “I know now, what I want to be. I want to be a teacher like you. Exactly like you. Thank you.” And I remember that I left it on her desk, and I was just waiting 23 for her to see it. And when she saw it, she went, “Oh.” And she couldn’t even talk, and I just left. I remember telling my mom, and now I can see how she was a little bit jealous because my mom was a great teacher too. Don’t get me wrong, excellent teacher, excellent team player. But I was her daughter. When she had me in her classroom, if I say, “Mama or Mommy.” I had a different test than everybody else because she had a coworker write it for me because, you know. I moved and I got punished, you know? So it was a different experience, but I understand now, why she did that. But back then, I didn’t. So for my mom she was a little bit like, “Oh.” Because I was looking at other teachers and not her. I went to college, the university at Puerto Rico—Puerto Rico University. And I just said, “This is what I’m going to do, I’m going to go to the education department.” I had great mentors there, too. I did my practice in a low-income school. It’s funny because in my head I had all of these good experiences with Señora Ubides with Señor Castro, with Señora Castro. I go to do my practice and for the first time I realize, “Oh wait, there’s interpersonal relationships too. Oh. It’s not going to be bueno.” I remember I was preparing and creating a door in a classroom and when I turned around, another—the only male teacher in that school kissed me on my mouth. I just went like, “Wait a minute… what?” And he goes, “Oh you are so cute.” Like I don’t know you. ST: That was weird. EB: He goes, “I know.” But in Puerto Rico they are very forward, the guys are. What they say, they know the game, they know what to say, what to do. I’m pretty sure he had tried that before and it was flattering but not for me. Especially in the 24 position where I was. Where men for me at that point was like, “No.” So, I just was like… His reaction was so opposite of my reaction that I couldn’t understand the connection. I mean, there was no connection, so I walked to the office and the principal that used to be a teacher of mine, too. I said, “So this guy just…” “Oh he probably meant to do it here.” [points to cheek] And I’m like, “But I was just decorating the door and I just turned around…” “He’s very friendly.” “So he says, ‘Hi’ like that to all of the teachers?” “Well you know, you’re new, you’ll get to know him.” And I’m like, “Uhhh…. Okay.” I’m thinking, “Well I’m just passing by. I’m not going to stay in this school. So whatever.” So I let it go. I remember she saying—I will never forget that—“He’s a veteran” I’m like, “What the? So? My father is a veteran? My brother is a veteran? What does that have to do with anything?” But it was like… it was the same back then, the harassment or bullying, none of that was named and always dismissed. Right? So then I started working at a… I wanted to be a teacher, but I needed to have money too, so I started working at an eye glass place with a doctor that prescribed the eyeglasses. I remember going one time—I was the receptionist. I was doing appointments and things like that. I show up in pants. It’s not like there is a lot of space behind the desk where all of the glasses are, right? So if he needed to pass, I had to move or… but he passed right behind me and he said, “I don’t want you using pants anymore to come to work.” I remember thinking, “What?” He goes, “No, come in skirts from now on.” Like, “There’s not a code in here…” “No, no, I don’t want you in pants anymore.” In my head, as a teen—because I 25 graduated very early. I was like, “This makes no sense why this guy… Why would he pass by me and just be so close and then said, ‘I don’t want you to wear pants anymore.’” It didn’t click. He would say, “Hey I will take you home. I can give you a ride.” I was like, “No.” Something just didn’t, you know? It probably meant nothing, but it didn’t feel right. So I started to learn to trust my red flags. I tell my daughters now, “If you feel those red flags coming up, just trust them.” And then I got a job as a teacher and because you are young and inexperienced, they gave me a rural part-time in there to teach English to first graders. And then I had to drive all the way to the suburban school to teach part-time also fourth grade, fifth grade, English. In Puerto Rico, by my time, my father would not allow us to have a license to drive. “You need to go somewhere, I’ll take you and I’ll pick you up. When you get married, your husband can do the same, only you take the test and get a license.” That’s how I grew up. So they would drive me, wait for me, or pick me up and drive me back too. In that school, again, those interpersonals I had a great time. [To Martin] That’s when I met Natty. An excellent teacher and I remember that the teacher that I was co-teaching with, would say, “Fabrary” and I’m like, “I don’t know, but I’m so sure in my house we say, February.” You know, I’m not going to correct it. And the way she said, August too. She said it different. Then I decided that I needed to be full-time in one place and I talked to a principal that knew my parents and I didn’t know then, what I know now. But my father went and put the word in because in Puerto Rico that works when you are known. That’s how I got a full-time job in that little community 26 school that was so darling. [To Martin] With Mateo. I just loved it. Loved it. But I was a different teacher than my coworkers. I was young, I had some rules like, “I will never touch you.” I came from the new school that we don’t do corporal punishment. And that was a new rule for that team. So I didn’t look good for them because I told my students, “You have the right to learn with me not hitting you.” I don’t see the need, it’s not going to happen. I don’t care how crazy you drive me. That’s not going to happen. You don’t push my buttons. But then I had coworkers that were still old school. Then kids started rebelling. “Well Señora Díaz said that it’s okay.” That created a problem with that. But I was a different teacher. Before Dual Language Immersion was, I told my students, “When you cross that bridge of that door, you’re in English.” Parents even complained. I said, “They will understand, don’t worry.” But I believe that if they are going to learn English, we have to be in English. So then I met this guy. Well I knew him before but he said that something something and I say yes. That’s when he decided to move to Utah, for many reasons. Then I came here. That’s my schooling. ST: So what is the biggest difference that you saw—besides the climate—coming from there to here? EB: Puerto Rico to here? MB: Culture. EB: So I went from being a proud Puerto Rican. You will never meet an unproud person. Is that a word? Puerto Ricans are proud. Like proud to be Puerto 27 Ricans, their flag is everywhere, you will know that we are Puerto Ricans, we will tell you. I came here and I became Mexican because everybody thought I was Mexican. If I speak Spanish, “You are Mexican.” And I’m like, “Don’t they know? They even send tax money to Puerto Rico from here.” MB: When you get asked, and when you tell them you are from Puerto Rico, they say, “Which part of Mexico is that?” Yes. EB: They say, “Costa Rica?” and we are like, “No, Puerto Rico.” “Oh where is that?” MB: [To Estrella] Do you remember what I said to that lady that I was from Puerto Rico and she said, “Is that where the Barack Obama family is?” EB: And he said, “No, it’s a different kind of brown people.” ST: Oh no. EB: I have been asked, even by Latinos, “How did you make here?” And I’m like, “An airplane.” “How did they let you in?” “Nobody stopped me?” Then, I realized, “Wait a minute, this is a problem.” You don’t know Geography. You don’t know that we are a part of you, in whatever you want to call it. I was born a U.S. Citizen, I did nothing, this was my ancestors and your people that decided to win Puerto Rico. How can I help? Because I’m not going to have this battle. I don’t believe in, “Walk in this morning and which idiot is going to ask me where I’m from.” You know what I’m saying? That’s not me. I can’t live like that. So I’m like, “Okay, so let’s educate these people. Let’s make it humorous.” For example, I have a daughter that looks exactly like him and I have a daughter that looks exactly like me. 28 She has green eyes. The daughter that looks like him, has gorgeous brown, proud, Puerto Rican long luscious hair. The one that looks like me is tough, Puerto Rican green eyes. She does whatever she needs to take to achieve her goal. We arrive here, she was just born, I was five months pregnant, the other one is two. And people will stop me in Smiths and say, “Are they sisters?” “Why do you care? And why do you feel like I’m going to answer?” But then I said, “Don’t tell my husband. We just moved here and this one is from him.” Because the one that looks like him is obviously his. That’s what I started saying because I’m like, “Really? Really.” So I need to make this and turn it into humor because there is no way that I’m going to confide in this. Then from the Latinos that are here in Utah, “You’re Mormon?” because we are not Catholics. I said, “I know, but we’re a different kind of one. We’re from an island.” You know what I’m saying? So that was the first thing was, how am I going to move forward with these questions? For example, my daughter was three and she comes running from outside, she was with him, and I said, “Why are you crying?” “The little girl said she didn’t want to play with me because I’m different.” And I said, “Yeah, you are.” That’s okay, but then I cried. It’s something that we have to move forward and educate people but not take it—I don’t take it personal, I just think lack of knowledge. And then again, I think when I was in 9th grade, 10th, 8th grade when Mr. Castro told me, “You’re doing things that are racist.” Or saying things. Most of the people don’t understand that that’s the view that they can present, you just have to turn it around. We had never had any mean spirited ever, it’s more curious stupidity than. 29 MB: Or ignorance. EB: Yeah. MB: But not like intended. EB: Meanness. Being mean. You know what I’m saying? And if it is, I don’t see it. I one time, had a principal that told me, you need to take some speech therapy so you can lose that accent. And I said to him, “Okay, so hold on, I’m going to restate what you just said to make sure you see that you just said that. Did you just say that I need to lose my accent to be able to be a teacher in Ogden City?” He goes, “Yeah.” I said, “You’re going to get up and walk right out of my classroom because the Puerto Rican is going to come out and then you are going to wait in your office because HR is going to call you in… how fast can you make it to the door?” ST: That’s good though that you don’t just passively take it sitting down, I think because nothing changes without people saying, “Hey that is not okay. Just like how your teacher did with you. It looks like he really influenced you with your dealings and the rest of your life. Like, “Hey, sir, that is not okay.” EB: That is not okay. ST: And this is why it’s not okay and you know, yeah, that’s really good. EB: Not only did I experience for Latina or not being Latina enough, discrimination. When I started working at Walmart, then I noticed that your culture about being fat. That was completely new to me. In Puerto Rico, in my 30 time you were skinny—you don’t have a grandma that feeds you or you are sick. Your dying. “Do you have cancer?” MB: Or AIDS. EB: Yeah. Morbidly obese, we understand that’s not healthy, but skinny is not like, “aww.” Curviest women are like, “Yeah!” and yes, I’m in my heaviest now, but back then—and I arrive and I’m doing my work and I’m in the toy department and… I get bikes from the ceiling and one of the guys comes to me and says, “Oh my gosh, you really work.” And I’m like, “Wait hold on, what do you mean I really work?” “No, you move, and you work.” “Isn’t that what you pay me to do?” “Oh wait, got it. Got it. You thought that because I’m heavy, I can’t do things as well. That’s okay. You found the first fat girl that can get a bicycle from the ceiling.” Even in church, this lady—I’ll never forget that it was in Layton. MB: Oh this is a good one. ST: Oh Layton. EB: My sister is next to me—my little sister. Everybody knows me, so the lady says and points at me, “Hey Sister Beltrán, what is the thing that you like to eat the most?” My sister holds my hand and in Spanish says, “Please don’t. Don’t be rude.” And I said, “Doughnuts” and because I already know the culture and this is a January lesson, I know where they are coming. Because in Puerto Rico, nobody in January talks about losing weight and then lose it by February, the talk. But I knew where she was going because I’m already knowing, I’ve already been here a few years. I said, “Doughnuts. I love doughnuts, but good 31 doughnuts.” And she goes, “How do you feel when you eat them?” and I know that she’s doing that guilt trip, that is common here in Utah, I said, “Oh my gosh, I bite, and I see the heavens opening and the Father and the Son and the choir.” And my sister is like, “Can I leave now?” I said, “Oh I’m sorry, I didn’t say what you wanted to hear? You should have picked someone else.” And then she says, “Well mine is pie and I eat the whole pie.” And I said, “I don’t eat 12 doughnuts. One a month.” This is not made out of all doughnuts. I shift the conversation in such a way and I said, “Why are you guys feeling guilty right after the holidays for a few weeks and then forget about it in February? Can you forget about it beginning of the year? I don’t know maybe it’s not working for you, but it has never worked for me. I’m a happy gordita, so that’s okay. So see that was another thing to get used to. The culture of that being skinny. MB: Fat is such a sin. I have come to observation that you call someone fat, it’s more offensive than if you call them the b word. ST: Yes. MB: Although EB: Where did that happen? MB: Although fat is just physical and the b word, to me, it has more of what and who you really are. Your… ST: Your essence. MB: Yeah. 32 EB: So when did that happen? When did you physical appearance determine how good of a person you are or how well you can perform? I don’t get it, how that happened. It’s incredible that society would put such a high price in how you look and not who you really are. I don’t think in my house that was ever a discussion. I know my older sister once got really offended because my mother said that to wear this dress she needed a griddle. And for her, that was a very, kind of like….Because we never talked about that, right? So it was not like, “What?” And in here, it’s like, an everyday thing that you hear it. Like for example, I went to a training in Salt Lake this week and they brought to the facilitators a box of Crumbl Cookies and I guess it’s a name brand, I had never had it. They are sugar cookies with different toppings. Apparently, they are very famous. So this is what they did, and this is the funniest thing. All the skinny girls got the cookies and cut it into fourths. In their heads, “If I eat just a piece, it’s okay.” At the end of the meeting, there was none. MB: So they had been eating little pieces by little pieces. EB: I said to one of them, “Oh my gosh, they’re all gone?” and she goes, “Oh my gosh, they’re all gone.” I said, “Did you share?” and she goes, “No, it was just the four of us.” I was like, “Then why did you cut them?” ST: Why did you put that work into cutting them if you are just going to eat them. EB: And she realized, and she says, “I’m going to go into a sugar coma.” I said, “You look fine to me.” I don’t know, it’s just… I think my daughters—let me tell you how that’s effected my daughters. When my daughter was—my little one was in sixth 33 grade and the other one in eighth grade. We took them to, for the first time, to a trip to Puerto Rico after ten years of not being there because the economy, we couldn’t take the whole family. I used to take them when they didn’t pay the tickets, but once they grew. So after ten years we took them back. This is what my older daughter said, “Oh my gosh, all of the girls in here look like me.” My heart just sank. She said, “Momma, in high school I was the only brown one. The only one that had the skirt that was higher in the back and lower in the front because I have a butt. Here, all of the girls are like that.” And then my second one says, “Yeah, and there’s a whole island of crazy people like you Mama and Papa.” “Thank you my darling.” So see? She didn’t realize until she saw that. And that in a way kind of hurts me because I wish we could have raised them in Puerto Rico. But that was the best decision we ever made to come here. I know Utah has been good to us, but that’s the part that hurts me the most is that she felt like a foreign all of her school years. Going back to Puerto Rico was part of her determination to, “Now I know who I am, where I belong, and I’m going to walk with pride.” And you know, that’s something that we—it hurts us. But, at the end it was a good decision, but that’s the part we couldn’t help with. MB: Many people underestimate the importance of the cultural background in accepting who you are. They, growing up, thinking that my mom and dad are so weird. They are so different to the other parents. And then they go to Puerto Rico and they found millions like we are. You know? 34 EB: When we used to do things—like my daughter, she’s in high school. “Are you going to buy me a car when I’m sixteen?” We are like, “Hold on, let me call your father’s brother, Mickey and let’s see…” Because she has a cousin that—she was born in February, the cousin two weeks later in March. I’m like, “Let’s call your cousin and let’s ask him if your uncle is going to buy him a car. Come on, call.” She goes, “Hey Tío, are you going to buy Saso a car?” “No. Nobody bought me a car when I was his age.” Same thing we said. She’s like, “Oh okay.” In Puerto Rico, you don’t buy your kids a car. You find a job and you buy your car. MB: Not only that, but you don’t get your driver’s license in school. If you want your license, you’re going to have to pay it through the government. EB: Yeah, we don’t have classes in school to get licenses. If you are female, forget it. You know what I’m saying? That was… and another thing that I think that just kills me when I think about Utah is other than in the kids is the sleepovers. When Latinos do sleepovers, it’s because the whole family is sleeping over. Cousins are getting together, families are visiting, and everybody sleeps in the sleepover. So I’m foreign to that. My daughter says, “So and so invited me to a sleepover.” “What? Why? You have a bed here and I don’t know them. I don’t know what’s going to happen. No way.” I remember there were in elementary and she was screaming that we have rules that she hates. That she hates all of these Latino rules and I said, “You know what?” I remember we had a van. “I hate rules too. All of my life—you see that stop sign? I’m not going to stop.” And they are in the back, “But, we hate rules, we hate rules.” I said, “Me too! That’s 35 why I’m not going to stop. I’m just going to go.” And I accelerated, and they are screaming in the back and I’m pretty sure I paid for therapy for that. They are like, “Mama, stop!” I said, “No, I hate rules!” Then I stopped and they were like, “Ahhh…” In their booster seats and I said, “Why do you think you wanted me to stop?” “Because we could get in an accident.” “The same reason I don’t want you to sleep over in anybody’s house.” I want to keep you safe, that’s all. That was the last of that conversation. So guess who got sleepovers in my house? Everybody came to my house. There were times that we had girls that would come just when they knew that he was cooking. ST: The smart ones. EB: Yeah. [To Martin] You’re hungry. MB: Very hungry. You didn’t feed me this morning. EB: Just chew on some gum. I learned that here too, that if you’re hungry, you eat gum it’s okay. That’s another thing that I learned, sleepovers. I had never heard of strangers asking my kid to go sleep with their kid. The other thing was the culture of funerals and weddings. They celebrate the same way with the line. ST: Yes. [Video stops] [Video resumes] EB: “Is there food?” and Martin goes, “It doesn’t look like it.” “It doesn’t?” “No.” “Oh look, we leave the presents there, we sat in the backyard, there was three mints, 36 and some nuts, and a little piece of cake.” And then you do the line… and water without ice. MB: Yeah. EB: And I’m like, “What’s wrong with these people? Aren’t we supposed to be celebrating?” ST: They party and food and dancing… EB: Everybody is happy, nobody is standing like that. Actually the bride and the groom come to every table to say hi. Then I went to a funeral and I said, “Oh!” In Puerto Rico, the ones that are mourning, sit down. ST: And talk. EB: And you greet them if you are close to them. If not, you sit right behind them, you pay your respect for a few minutes and then you go. ST: Okay. EB: But you don’t just stand there for hours. I thought, “This is a very interesting culture.” I had never seen this before. I got called one day, “Hey, can you make some funeral potatoes?” And I’m like, “Oh Lord, is that how they look, how they smell…” MB: You will walk through and put them into a casket? EB: The ingredients? 37 ST: I never thought of that because I grew up with that. We have that not just for funerals, we have that for everything all of the time. EB: But if you’re calling me, you know, evidentially I’m not from here. Then I said, “Will you give me the ingredients?” And then when she says….”It has this this and this.” I was like, “Oh, scalloped potatoes with cream. Gotcha.” I didn’t know. Or the parties that they said, “You bring your own meat and we will get together.” For that I do that in my house. I don’t understand why we would bring our own food to eat together. Because when you’re in Puerto Rico, they invite you. ST: They cook. EB: They invite you. ST: Everything, you’re just bringing your bodies. MB: Exactly. ST: They’re putting everything else together. EB: And then I learned, “Okay, let’s take things.” Then you take the leftovers with what you brought. You don’t do that in Puerto Rico. If I said, “Okay, let’s get together… bring doughnuts.” You don’t take the leftover doughnuts, I put the house, you leave that to me. That’s your... ST: Like you’re not offering, but you are giving. MB: Thank you for…. ST: Thank you for having me over and being in my presence. 38 EB: Don’t take leftovers. Or working lunch, what’s that of working lunch? If I’m working, I’m working. If I’m having lunch, I’m having lunch. They don’t mix together, or people eating doing facilitating trainings or during a meeting. What? You’re chewing over there, your making noise with things, and it’s okay? I loved this, we can eat! Because you don’t see that in Puerto Rico. ST: When you are facilitating and doing things that’s here and then you have lunch later. EB: Yes. ST: And do things later. EB: And you don’t snack, and you don’t eat, that’s disrespectful to eat while that person over there is training or presenting. You don’t do anything else. MB: You have your eyes there. EB: And then this one has almonds and this one has a whole bag of Jolly Ranchers and it’s encouraged, you see the principals bringing in things during the meetings and at the beginning, I remember saying, “This is the best place on earth.” Once a year they open strangers homes and they ask, “Trick or Treat” And they give you things. “What? Oh my gosh, that is amazing.” We lived in Grantsville, they let you in their homes. There’s the dining table covered with stuff and hot cider and hot cocoa and I’m like, “They give you stuff, Martin!” MB: They give you stars and little mouth things and little cupcakes and cookies. ST: Now what’s the address of this place so I can go? 39 EB: Grantsville. They used to call us the Walmart family because Martin used to work for Walmart and we were not working in the fields, so we were the Walmart family. Yes. I said, “Martin, they let you in.” Because I know that if I don’t talk, they let me in. But they let you in. It’s the best town on earth. Halloween, what is that? ST: Free candy. EB: And then I remember in Tooele I took my girls for Halloween; the woman comes out and gives each one a tic-tac. I said, “No no, I already know the culture. If you don’t have anything then don’t open the door. I already know.” See they tried to fool me and I’m like, “No no, where’s your candy?” My daughter is like, “Ma, let’s go.” You learn fast, you have to. So I would say those are the biggest now. So let’s say the positive, I had never seen people that are more eager to volunteer their time anywhere in my life. In Puerto Rico, there usually has to be something for me. I can volunteer, but at the end there’s something for me. We all clean the beach but then we are going to have a barbeque, I’m going into the water. Or yes, I’m going to come help you but then you’re going to cook for me. You know what I’m saying? In here, people they volunteer out of their hearts with nothing to take back. That I had never seen ever before. Ever. They have a sense of, “We are going to attack this all together.” And then yes, the retreat and never talk again, but when they have to do it, they do it. Right? That’s amazing. I had never seen that before. The way they welcome people that are new. The majority are really really welcoming. Yes, they have a loving inquisitive 40 question and that’s okay. But they are very welcoming. We have seen that, Utah has been good to us with that. The other thing is the seasons. In Puerto Rico, we have one season, summer all year long. In here, to see the seasons, so refreshing. The mountains are just—I take pictures I think once a week because even after leaving here since 1994, they are just incredibly beautiful. MB: You don’t get over them. EB: I don’t get over it. MB: You don’t get over those mountains. You don’t get over the colors in Fall. EB: In any station, any season. MB: You just don’t. EB: This blue sky that we get in winter in Utah is just so beautiful when you look at the mountains, they look like they are fake. Like somebody just painted them, that is just stunning. I cannot say. The organization—to some point I hope if Utahns can learn something from me it would to shake it up a little bit and be more unpredictable and not be so driven because they are so organized and sometimes they forget the human side. Like every morning I got to whatever school I am, and this is how I do, “Good morning!” Because if I don’t do it like that, they don’t answer back. If I pass by an office and I say, “Good morning” I don’t hear any good mornings back because they are so organized and focused. I hope that they will shake it a little bit. Cleanness, we have visited other states, Utah is—the roads are so clean. 41 MB: Yes. EB: Everything. Everybody is very aware of that of that we are clean, we are organized, we keep things running, we love it. Now, Black Friday is when you all become Latinos. There’s no organization, you fight for what you want, and you run with it. That’s okay. The first time I saw Black Friday, I laughed the whole way through. I said to him, he worked at Walmart, I said, “Papa, this is incredible. Look at them how they are pushing like we do. This is awesome.” Because I had never seen that ever, ever before. Then I will walk around with all the items in my cart. I didn’t have money to buy, I just will say, “You want it?” Because people will look at your cart like, “Oh…” “You want it?” Oh that was so awesome. Awesome. Once a year, you guys let it go and that’s okay. That’s okay. ST: So we need to work on letting it go more. EB: Yes, shake it a little bit. Stop, stop and go outside. Or if you are in an office all of the time. Like in my office now, I’m at the district, I was so confused, I didn’t know that they munch all day if we were not supposed to stop for lunch. I asked to the boss in front of everyone, “I’m confused, can we have lunch? How long is lunch because these women are always in front of the computer and they just eat, eat, eat but not really eat.” “No, no, you have thirty minutes.” So why is nobody taking lunch? The union fought—whatever union for teachers to not have to wear diapers and to stop, use the restroom, and eat lunch. Why are you not honoring that? Why are you not honoring that? This week, I saw Jeanine walk 42 into the kitchen, warming her food and staying there and I’m like, “Stop it, are you having lunch away from your computer?” She’s like, “Yes.” ST: Were you proud? EB: And then I said to the boss, “We’re a team, right? We are a good team.” I mean that team has the best of the best specialists. About once a month we just get together and just be humans? Can’t we just have a lunch? Or a get together where we can dedicate to just not talk about anything but getting to know each other? “We used to.” And? Because it’s so automatized, that it’s like, “I work with you. You are right next to me, but I know nothing about you.” It’s hard. I don’t know that. In Puerto Rico, sometimes it could be that you are in everybody’s business, but if you are going through cancer, you don’t hide that. We are going to love you through it. If you are having problems with your teen kids, vent. I also had a teen kid or whatever it is. But no, and that’s hard. That’s hard, but I learned to be more, you know…. MB: Private. EB: Private. I learned that to be more private. That in Puerto Rico, no… There’s no privacy. Everybody knows everybody’s business. So that I like in a way. But sometimes it can get to the extreme. You know what I’m saying? Yeah. But yeah, Utah has been good to us. I cannot complain, I miss Puerto Rico, don’t get me wrong. I always tell my daughter, “My culture is Puerto Rico, my home is Utah.” Because I have good relationships, it has been good to me, I have a job here that I love. But my culture is Puerto Rico. It’s where I feel free. I feel like, I 43 don’t know if you have ever had that experience moving out from Utah and then coming back where you are like, “Yeah…” MB: This is my element. EB: This is who I am. ST: Yes. EB: Yeah. So it’s refreshing to go and now that we are in a better position economically that we can go more often. It’s really nice. It’s really nice. MB: And that we don’t have to be for more people. EB: Yes, because my daughter asked me, “Hey mom, I want to go to Puerto Rico.” And I go, “That’s really good. You now work away from my house and you work. Yeah, do you want me to tell you when the tickets are on special?” And she’s like, “What?” And I’m like, “Yeah.” “You don’t want to pay for us?” “No. You’re not on my health insurance, you’re not on my car insurance, you don’t live in my house, I learned a lot from the people here in Utah.” Nope. “I can’t afford it.” “Then you can’t go.” ST: But that’s a very good lesson to not just give them everything that they want, all of the time. EB: And my other daughter, she didn’t even ask because she has plans to go to school back after having the baby. He’s four and now she’s in a position where she can go back to school because he’s going to school too. That’s not even a question of, “I’m going to go.” She’s focused, she’s going to go back to 44 school. She’s driven to do that. But if she would have asked, I would have said, “No, not going to happen.” At this point, we had had conversations where we started when they were in high school—12th grade right? When they were seniors? I said to him, “We need to find out a common ground again. Once the girls are older, they’re not going to be our common ground anymore. If we don’t get that, we are going to get divorced. So let’s find something we both like, let’s start building on that, right?” It has been eating. We like to experience restaurants and… MB: Yeah, this is not my doughnuts. EB: No. ST: It’s good food. EB: Yes, little places that nobody knows, like little secrets that have good food, right? And we started building on that. Now it’s meditating. MB: Which she is very good. EB: So now we go out and I don’t even think twice about inviting the girls. That was not me. MB: We used to do things alone and I remember the first time he said, “You need adult time.” He took me to a hotel room and I kept calling the babysitter and she says, “They’re asleep, if you call one more time, you are coming back because if they wake up, I’m not staying.” And he’s like, “I told you.” But it was difficult for 45 me, right? Because I was very protective. So now it’s like I don’t even have to think twice. I said, “Martin, let’s go to Heber. Let’s take the canyon.” MB: Let’s go to Moab. EB: Yeah, and we didn’t tell them. And they were like, “Aww…” And I’m like, “Sorry, you’re independent now, you are in Utah.” Because in Puerto Rico, it’s all family oriented. Either we all go, or nobody goes. But, we had learned that. Like for us not to go with the girls to Puerto Rico, the whole family, “You’re not brining your grandkid? The girls?” I’m like, “Nope.” “Why? Are there problems?” “No. They don’t have money.” MB: It’s a problem for them, not for us. EB: For us…. So yeah, Utah has been good at teaching me how to be more organized and more focused and private. Yeah. That’s new. I’ve been building on that. Anything else? ST: So it sounds like all of your experiences in your childhood have made you the kind of teacher you are today. EB: Yes, definitely. Yes, and can I tell you that I was not an easy child. If my parents will be here, they would say, “I don’t know what we did wrong. We had four before her, everything was fine. We had one after her, it was fine. This fifth one, I don’t know what happened.” When I decided to become a teacher, I knew what kind of kid I could influence. I wanted to give myself an opportunity in others because let me tell you, I got hit by teachers. I received a lot punishment, I broke a lot of rules. But I was really smart too. I knew I could give that kid the 46 opportunity to be free, to be creative, but still learn. Like, one of my rules in my classroom was, “We are going to have fun, but controlled fun.” I had a principal once, he had come walking in my classroom and kids were reading with feet up in their desk or underneath their desk, or underneath the table, and she was going to correct them and I said, “No.” They were not looking at her, they were looking at their book. I said like this to her because if I say to you whatever space you have, that’s okay. But the moment that I told Sarah, can you continue the reading? You better be where we are because if not, we are going to have a problem. Kids were with me. I had a student, that I will never forget, it’s Zach. Last year he said, “You know what Señora Beltrán, I have never followed the reading as long as today. That was awesome.” And I’m like, “Wow, sixth grade dude.” “I know.” ST: Yeah. EB: Listen, sit in a chair in front of a desk reading, do you live at home? You don’t do that at home? Why would I expect that from my students? So I gave that opportunity to my students, we were going to review a unit, I’m not going to review the unit, you’re going to review the unit, so you create a test, so you make me a PowerPoint, so you make me a pamphlet, whatever it is, let’s review. That’s the kind of teacher I was. Yes, I was very structured, because again, I know what not having structure can do, because that was me. So I know there has to be structures but there were celebrations too and there was creativity and yes, I was demanding, because even in first grade I explained to my students, “I like one ugly thing. In the whole—in my whole life, I like one ugly 47 thing, Señor Beltrán. You’ll meet him, you’ll meet him. He’s like that fruit rambutan really ugly on the outside, but when you open it it’s delicious.” He’s really a nice guy, but he’s ugly. And he will come in and the kids are like, “Oh.” I said, “Don’t stare too much.” So he will come in and usually they are like… ST: Trying to see how ugly he is. EB: But he will always come in with lunch or goodies. I said, “I told you! He’s a nice guy. He’s just ugly.” So when they will give me a paper, I will go, “Oh, that was not up to my expectations. I only like one ugly thing remember? Señor Beltrán. I think you need to do that again. Okay.” So even in first grade I had structure and expectations, right? But I always put it in a way that they didn’t feel like I was attacking them, it’s me. I’m the one with the problem, by sixth grade, I will tell them, “I am the poster child of control. You have no idea of who I was as a kid. So if I can control myself, you can control yourself.” So I connected. I have seen it through the years, I will get a student that before was suspended multiple times. They come to me, they never got suspended. But I have one-on-one talks and I will say, “I get it, I get it too. It’s like a thing that starts working here and then the next thing you think; your hands are moving, and you are hitting. I get it. I’m going to give you ways that you are going to cope with that, because I haven’t hit you all year. Look, so if I can do it, you can do it.” So we work through that and I was the behaviorist without the title. You will tell a second grader, “You’re going to Señora Beltrán’s classroom, I need you to control yourself.” “Oh, okay, no problem.” And with Latino’s, because I speak like their mama’s. I had a 48 principal that comes to my door and says, “Señora Beltrán, I’ve been speaking to him for more than thirty minutes, he doesn’t grasp what I’m trying to tell him. He was misbehaving.” And I just have to look at him, speak in Spanish and said, “You disappointed, you’re not representing my Raza.” That is my race. Bullying—and the principal goes, “Wait a minute, you just said two sentences and he’s crying. I’ve been talking to him for 30 minutes.” “You don’t speak like his momma.” I, as a teacher, I can connect with the rebellious, the one that is creative and the one that has anger issues because I had it too. Actually this… MB: Still. EB: This last week, I talked to my older sister that she is all heart. That woman is all heart. She’s the second in my house. She said to me, “Why do you think we were so violent?” You know? And I said, “I don’t know” because I don’t have memory of them hitting each other, my parents. Yes, there were discussions and yes there were things flying, things like that. But never physical. And she goes, “I don’t know, we have anger.” I said, “Yes, we do.” That’s why I meditate. It was funny because I said, “I’m going to get you a Mala so you can start learning how to meditate.” But yeah, I can connect with those and I think that’s the kind of teacher I was. They had like a principal that once said, healthy fear of the consequences but they also knew that I had their back and I was their best advocate. Nobody will—I expected the best for them and from them, but nobody messes with my kids. Once they carry my last name. Because I told them, “How are you known?” “Señora Beltrán’s class.” “Then you have to own it, I’m going to treat 49 you like I treat me kids. So you represent me now.” So I think that’s the kind of teacher I am, a combination of obedience, I was very warm and funny. The combination of Castro that was in your face telling you, “No.” And a combination of Señora Castro that it was all—by the way they are not related those two— Creative and open and let’s do this in a different way. Yeah, I just realized that. MB: Yes. ST: So is that what you hope in your position right now at the school district, is that what you hope to pass some of those qualities on to other teachers? I know that you work with ELL and that kind of stuff. EB: And Dual Language Immersion. ST: So when you go into their classrooms do you try to pass on some of those things? EB: Yes, I want to—the first thing that I look when I enter a classroom is if there is a relationship between teacher and students. You can see that easily. Connections can be positive or negative. So that’s the first thing that I look, “How are these students reacting to this teacher and how is this teacher connecting with the students.” The second thing that I look is like, “Is there rules in place?” I’m not saying that it has to look like we are living in the Marines, but that there are some rules in place. The third, how is the learning being imparted? Am I just a talker and the kids are just receiving that for me is a no no. Is there some interaction in between? Is there fluidity in that learning, right? And that is, “Ah ha” moments. When I sit with the teacher to coach, I present it like that 50 too. Were there connections? Were you modeling the lesson? Were the students receiving that lesson? Was there an income and outcome? Or as we say, an input or output, right? How were they receiving it and how were they transferring that out? Sometimes there’s that disconnection, right? But eventually at the end, when I coach—and I always try to finish an idea in a positive way of saying, “You can do this. You are the beacon of hope and know it’s difficult, but we can.” But because, again, I had learned that from the culture in Utah, religious or nationwide, or whatever that we are so hard on ourselves. For some reason people think that they have to be perfect—perfect bodies, perfect at their job, your hair, whatever it is. I don’t see that. I just see that, “Okay it wasn’t what you wanted, let’s not dwell in that. How are we going to make it better?” So when I provide the teachers with feedback, I always say, “This is the three things I want you to work on and this is how you can work on it.” It’s not just, “I didn’t like this.” I’m like, “So this could be better. Look at how we can do it.” So I try to give more steps, but I always kept the teacher in decision making. So this is my suggestions, what do you think can be? I love it because I still have the, “Ah ha” moments. The other day in your mom’s school, I had a teacher go, “Wait a minute, I do that in English language, when I teach vocabulary. Why don’t I do that with the vocabulary now?” And I said, “Exactly, it’s still language, it’s just math language. So you can teach it as explicit as you teach the vocabulary before reading a text.” I’ve seen those teachers have those vocabulary moments. I’m like, “Oh!” And like with your mom, I knew she was underappreciated because I had been there. 51 I know what she’s carrying in shoulders because I have been there. I’m like, “How can I tell her that I understand and that I appreciate her.” And the first thing that came to my head was when I had her face-to-face, “I want you to teach my grandkid. Please say, he’s only four. But please, you are perfect for him. You are strong, but you celebrate, you connect with them, you are so explicit, you model, you have the variety of the same example, please.” And she just laughed. I knew I made a connection because if she is a grandmother she knows how protective grandmothers. I know she knows Latinos, so now she goes, “Wow.” But I meant it. So sometimes it’s not just a question because for your mom there was nothing I needed to tell her. You know? You just have to be nitpicky here and there. Because there is nothing really, but I knew that was the moment I made a connection because I meant it. I never compliment if I don’t mean it. But again, I never answer questions if you are not ready to hear the answer. That’s who I am, you can ask my friends. When people say, “Can I ask you a question?” You’ll hear my friend, “Oh lord, if you’re not ready for the answer don’t ask her.” You know? But if I compliment, you will also see my friends like, “What did Estrella? Oh…Estrella said something nice.” Because I don’t give them freely either. MB: Even me, I’m like, “Oh that was a compliment. Yes! Score!” EB: And you know that that’s one of the hardest things as a coach because in the education department, we have what is called, “Four to one”. You give four positives to one negative. But in my culture, you are expected to do somethings that I don’t need to compliment you. For example, pay attention, don’t talk when 52 somebody else is talking. I don’t need to tell you thank you because that is what is supposed to happen. So you will see how especially in the Latino teachers have a hard time complimenting four to one negative because it’s cultural. But I have seen the benefits of that because if I have kindergarteners and this kid is not sitting crisscross apple sauce and is talking but this one is. I say, “Oh my gosh, Sarah, thank you. I love the way you are sitting, I love your eyes on me, you make me feel special.” And then I look at that one and go… So I have seen the benefits. I wish my parents would have known about this four-to-one because when I look back, I never did anything right because they don’t do that. They expect you to do something and then they are not thankful for that. That’s what you are supposed to do. Now if you go beyond what you are expected, then they are like, “Oh well, thank you for doing that.” Or they usually say, “You want something. Why is that you are taking the trash out again?” See what I’m saying, but that was something that I had learned from my time in here, that four-to-one being positive. I try at home to—with him, it’s difficult because you give him one positive and he takes it. MB: They come so sparsely. EB: He makes such a big deal. MB: It’s like, “Yeah!” You celebrate it. EB: You see what I’m saying? With him it’s like two-to-one. ST: So you spoke about your involvement with helping after the hurricane. EB: Yes. 53 ST: Is there any other things that you volunteer for in your community and such here? EB: In Puerto Rico it’s part of growing up to get that card to vote. They have identification cards. I still have mine. I will find it so you can… because it’s like a milestone. I’m an adult now. It’s part of our culture. You never change your address because the day of voting, you come back to your neighborhood and you see all of your friends. It’s actually also a holiday, nobody works. I know, we Puerto Ricans, we have a party for anything. I mean with voting, no working. Let’s go back home, let’s see old friends. Can you imagine? It’s amazing. So it’s a big deal, when I was in college, I was the public relationship for the student body. I brought in all of the politicians from Puerto Rico that were running for governor. So we have the one’s that believed in us becoming part of the United States, the one that believed in us…. MB: In statehood. EB: In statehood, being part of the state. The one that wants to stay as we are as a commonwealth, and the one that wants to be independent. So I coordinated all of that with our people and I brought them in to talk. I treated them equally, I had never put a stamp on who I am, what I believed publicly, I don’t—I think that’s so private, but also, you need to hear every side, right? Just recently I learned that Rubén Berrios the one that was running back then to the independent party and I related to him. His mom is my grandma’s sister. I didn’t know that. We have been working on our ancestries. And it was really fun, but also very interesting to hear how they talk. The guy that was running for the independent party had a 54 power with words. I mean, he moved the youth like nobody. He was just like Obama that has a power with words and moving crowds. So it was very interesting to see him in front and behind because I picked them up, I brought them, I had them in the green room, whatever. Then we moved here, and we were part of the La Raza MB: The Utah Coalition of La Raza EB: And this is the problem that I have with that again. We were going to their meetings, we were—I even helped facilitate to help Latino’s think—we did a whole weekend of Latino kids in high school to think of being part of college and moving forward and we had booths and all of that. It was amazing. Then we had a meeting and they were starting to bash the LDS church. Of course, they didn’t know that we are because they assume that we are Catholic. I look at Martin and I said, “No, I’m not part of this.” As far as we go in helping Latinos, I’m in for it. The moment that you do that, I’m out. I’m a very loyal sucker. That’s why I’ve been with Ogden School District. I’m loyal, this is why this guy is going to year 27. I believe and I stick with it, right? So I believe in that helping Latinos, the moment that they deviated, and they spent 30 minutes talking about the Mormons, I’m out. So we stopped going. But one of the things that I had learned the more that I study, and I read about women and history is that we have always had a voice. It’s just where and who we shared it with. I was reading this book and it’s called, Becoming Athena. We talked between ourselves, but we were not being listened to. But we always had discussed politics, we always had discussed the future of our kids and our concerns, it’s just who was listening? Or 55 how we were allowed to bring it forward, right? Past ourselves. In my house, that was a—that’s not a negotiation. You are going to vote, if I have to drive you, I drive you. But you are going to vote—this was to my daughters. We study about it and we talk about it. There are some things that are too evident to even discuss, it’s like, “Can you believe that?” That’s incredible, so we don’t discuss it that much when it’s so evident. When they start like now, in Puerto Rico they have a saying that says, ario revuelto, ganancia de pescadores and I’m going to translate it roughly. When the river is… MB: When the river races and there is a lot of water flowing and… EB: The fisherman—it’s the fisherman’s gain, because the fish are everywhere. MB: And the fisherman benefits. EB: So right now we are having that sense that everybody wants to run for president. Yay! That’s the river with a lot of water moving. So that’s going to be for our benefits because there is going to be a lot of platforms put out there and a lot to investigate and to choose for. I prefer… MB: And also challenge what we believe in. EB: Exactly. I prefer to have a position open at the district and twenty people that have entry. So I love it. So we have been discussing more, “Oh there’s a new one. Let’s see what this one brings, right?” So I love it right now that that is going. But I also know that behind every one of these positions there is a battery of people that is the one that really runs the show and I understand that. But women have always been on at the forefront. Always. That now, we are heard, 56 that now we have power. Let me tell you how passionate I am about that. I have a dear friend a dear dear friend, I adore him. We have been through thick and thin. When the congresswomen were all dressing white and they were standing, I don’t care. I don’t even know democrats or republicans. I really don’t care. I care that they are united. I care that this is the most we have ever had. He posted on Facebook a picture of that but altered with the Ku Klux Klan caps and says, “Watch for the new Ku Klux Klan.” MB: With a hidden agenda. EB: I called him, and I said, “I am so sorry. One that is not funny to me. Two, you are African American, and you are making fun of the KKK? MB: Afro-Caribbean. EB: Afro-Caribbean, you are making fun of the KKK? That is not right in my eyes. And third, I need to say goodbye from you on Facebook because you know me. I can’t. I’m sorry, have a good life. I don’t care who is who. This is powerful that they were united because usually they put the women to the curb, right? That they were united, that tells me, “Yes! We can move this forward. Let’s have more.” I don’t care your sexual orientation and I don’t care your color and I don’t care your religion, but you are representing me as a woman. Yes! Let’s have it, let’s celebrate it, let’s mention it. Ocasio is her name, right? The Puerto Rican? MB: Yes. 57 EB: The way that she was. have you seen that video of her walking in that day dressed in white? Oh my gosh, it looks like every step that she is taking the world by the horns. Like here I am! Yes, I was a server in a restaurant and so what? And yes, English is my second language. I mean, seeing her walking and looking at the men, because they were looking at here and I’m like, “I know, I’ve been there.” When you walk with that strength that you have all of the power of who you are right with you. How successful she is going to be, I don’t know. She is not perfect, I didn’t even vote for her. But it made me so proud. It made me so proud to see her there. I was like—and I talked to my daughter and my second one is always like, “Ma, remember before we vote we need to talk. You need to tell me.” Because she is not a reader and she says, “You need to tell me, who is who because I don’t know.” Because it’s part of our conversations. But when you cross the line with things like that, like that representation of that picture, I can’t handle it. I know we have to accept our differences and I know we have to be civil and I know we have to give to receive, but I draw lines. That is one that I will draw. I’m like, “Nope.” And don’t get me wrong, I talk to him, we spent time with him yesterday. MB: Yesterday, yeah. EB: In that forum, I’m not following you and I can’t compromise who I am because I think of a friendship, that’s not me. ST: No, I completely understand that. 58 MB: I took him out of my friends list on Facebook. I’m not like that. I thought it was totally offensive and disrespectful. EB: Oh he didn’t even talk to him, [pointing to Martin] he just cut. ST: Yeah, that’s what I do. Like presidential things, like when people say things and LGBTQ+ things and people say things that I cannot believe that are coming out of their mouths. And I’m like, “I really like this because I can do this, and you are gone, and I don’t ever have to see you again.” EB: And there comes the educator in me that I think it’s nature already. I want to reach out, what if there is some misunderstandings. He doesn’t though and that’s because that’s the way he was raised. I want to reach out because you are important to me. I want to know maybe by talking we reach an agreement, so in this case we didn’t and that’s why I say goodbye. But I have friends that think different about LGBTQ but the moment that I see that—they cross that line, I’m going to tell them. He doesn’t he just goes, “You’re out.” I tell them, I said, “I’m sorry we talk this, I mean if you are my friend we need to talk this.” And then I decide, “Yes, we are continuing or not continue.” He doesn’t give the opportunity, he’s just like, “You’re out.” But that’s just who I am and that’s okay, you can be like that. [To Martin] The moment that I see you cut me off of Facebook, get your things packed up and go. MB: Okay. ST: That’s funny. So based on your life experience, what advice would you give to women today and the future generations? 59 EB: Educate yourself. Don’t be afraid, I had a staff assistant that was afraid of taking a job with more pay and more money and more responsibility because English was her second language. Her name is Nora and I said, “No, I love you and of course I want to keep you, but nobody should stop your progress.” “But the English…” “So what? Go for it, you fake it until you make it.” And if you need a dictionary, you need a dictionary. That’s support for you.” So she did, she was even put in the newspaper because the kids were honoring her. “I knew how good she was.” MB: And they are reacting to her so positively. EB: Oh my gosh, she works with the kids that are more likely not to graduate and she is amazing. But I knew that she was. I tell women, “Go, educate yourself, the door opens, and you go right in and then you look up, downward and you say thank you and keep going.” Don’t be afraid, there is nothing written about people that are afraid. I don’t see books selling about how I was afraid, and I stayed home. So educate yourself, let opportunities come and take them, grab them. Be powerful, even if you don’t believe it. I’m sure you are going to say, “Oh look I did that, that was pretty good.” And you start building on that, that’s self-talk that I don’t know where it comes. I don’t ever hear a man self-talking down. They don’t talk about that when they are together. But you hear women and their self-talk is like, “I need to start eating cupcakes without sugar.” “What?” The names says that it has sugar, “Cup… Cake…” eat a muffin. Cupcakes are muffins that believe in unicorns. Why do you? You hear groups of women and their self-talk and they talk and it’s not up. You never hear a guy talking about, “I 60 wanted to get some jeans and I went in the fitting room and I looked terrible.” They don’t talk like that. Why do we talk like that? No. Feel that you are powerful, act like you are powerful, take charge and eventually you will do it and you will be. Never. Those conversations, I will not allow in front of me. If I hear somebody said, “My husband will not allow me to do it.” And I go, “Wow, you are not saying that in front of me.” No, he can suggest, he can support, he can disagree, but you are the one that makes the final decision. “My husband will not like me without long hair.” “What?! Cut your hair.” We even hear it in the famous, the medical track, “If I gain this many pounds, he’s going to divorce me.” “Then he wasn’t good from the beginning.” You should see our marriage photos, when I’m in bride… we look so young, so skinny, MB: 135 pounds. EB: I’m not going to say mine. And people say, “What happened?” And I said, “We were having a good time.” MB: 27 years of good marriage. EB: It’s not negative but that’s self-talk has to change, it has to change. And that bickering, no. There’s no need for that. I don’t’ hear them, talking like that. I never hear a man like that. And be powerful, like for example, when I hear a woman say to me, “I stopped talking to my husband, we had fight.” I said, “You just did what he wanted. That’s when you sit by him and you talk about everything, don’t leave his side.” I don’t get it. Or I’m going to be out of the box in here, “When he asks, we’re not going to have sex, I’m not with him.” “Wait a 61 minute, so what you are saying is that you are punishing him because he’s the only one that enjoys it?” I don’t get it. I don’t get it. What are you telling him, what message are you sending? Don’t talk—I can’t. That’s when my filter goes out, beads don’t work. I’m like, “Why are you talking like that in front of me? That’s not how it is.” And yes, sometimes I say the darnest things and my friends go, “Wow.” MB: Sometimes?!. EB: But if you bring that up, that you are second class citizen or that you are giving them more power when you have the power, you are the one with the power. I can’t handle that. It just doesn’t work with me. The other day, I was telling my husband—actually it was yesterday. I said, “You have no idea how much I love you for how you know me better than anybody else.” I had a hard conversation this week. He knew that I had that hard conversation with that person. I came home thinking, “Please don’t ask me, I’m not ready.” You think he asked me? No. Three days have passed, so yesterday I said, “Thank you, Martin.” Thank you for giving me my space. Thank you for letting me process it so when I voice it I’m ready to hear it. There is a connection when you think about it, but once you make it out, it’s there to stay. I believe it’s recorded, the universe takes it, right? I don’t open my mouth if I’m not thinking that the universe is going to take it. So I’m so glad that I have a man that is so supportive. That he was my friend before my husband, that was key in me having a partner, because he knew me already. This has been something that he has done from the beginning. I remember, I just barely—didn’t 62 even have a year. She was my first daughter, it wasn’t even a year and for the first time after probably 9 years I see the boyfriend that I thought I loved the most. My first love in high school. I was with him for many years and I saw him for the first time, and I went home, and I said to him, “I’m confused.” Not that that guy wanted to do anything with me, that there was a possibility, but I was confused. And because he was my friend before my husband and he knew about that, I said, “I’m confused, I don’t know. Can I process this? Will you give me time?” I don’t think any other husband would have acted like that, he said, “Sure, okay, how much time do you want?” I’m like, “I don’t know.” He goes, “Okay.” Then I realized, it’s not what I miss it’s that I want something with that person—a relationship is what it was because you tend to remember the positives only. Then I took time to revisit that relationship and I went, “Oh yeah, no…” “Oh yeah, yep, now I remember.” But because it took me so off-guard. And then I went back to him and he was like, “I knew that was going to be the outcome.” MB: I knew that relationship. EB: And I’m like, “Oh my goodness, I hate you and I love you at the same time.” So that was the first time that he gave me space. But it has been multiple times where he had been an excellent man to be by myside. And I understand that not every man can handle who I am, so I’m glad that I have him because I know sometimes he tells me—he has friends that, “Is she for real? Or is she just blowing hot air?” “She’s for real.” Like he had a good friend that came to the house and I said, “Martin, I’m leaving I’ll be back.” And he goes, “Wait a minute, 63 where are you going?” And I turn around and I go, “Wait hold on, let’s redo this again.” I said to his friend, “There’s two things that you have to do with me for me to tell you where I’m going. From the side of man and me a woman, we have a bank account together and you’re the one doing the direct deposits or we’re together in bed.” So no, I’m not telling you where I’m going and he turned to him and said, “Martin, you’re not going to ask her where she is going?” and he goes, “No.” See and he has those two. So get yourself in place, excuse me, and I left. I know some of his friends really think, “What the?” But he has nothing to fear. Actually I was just going to Walmart to buy something. Do you know what I’m saying? But why will he think that he could ask me? I don’t even know if he was trying to be funny? I don’t take it funny. So I understand that some of his friends think that this is too much. [To Martin] You don’t think I’m too much right? MB: No, mi amor. ST: Good answer. MB: Score. EB: So yeah, that’s what I say to women. Do it, it can be done, look where I am. MB: I’m going to interject. I had a conversation with a student. She was complaining that this boy called her a name and I told her, “Yes, and you have complained before about that. But you know what? I believe that it’s your fault because when the bell rings, you guys go out, and you guys hangout with the same girls. The reason why he keeps calling you those names is because the first 64 time, you didn’t stop him. You allowed him to do it and to get away with it, because if it is so offensive, the friendship ends. So, he needs to understand that he needs to respect you.” I think women need to do that. I’m going to talk about in the United States because other countries are different. There is no reason why a woman needs to think that they have to have a man. Yes, it makes it a lot easier to raise a family, but it’s even hard with the two parents. We are social beings, you know? We need that. But that you need to have a man to make it, no. That you need to put up with this disrespect and belittling? No. No. Have self-dignity give yourself a place and you will see that you will be able to have a man that will respect you for that and that will stick around because of that. That’s it because I remember the first time that I even raised a little bit of my voice, she told me, “Don’t you ever talk to me like that.” You see? Right there and then, it was stopped. That is what needs to happen more. Women need to understand that again, it’s mutual, that respect. And I am not above you and you are not above me. We are going to pull this together. But society for the longest time has taught that women follow the men or that men are above or whatever it is. Which should not be. It should be, “This relationship should always be egalitarian. 100% and not a smudge past compromise. EB: I don’t like that word. MB: Compromise means that one of the two will have to give in. I think it should be consensus where both of us are equally in agreement. That’s what it is supposed to be because it’s not what have been perfect for so long, the supremacy of men over women. 65 EB: Well imagine this phrase, “Behind every great man there’s a woman.” Wait a minute, where’s behind? Why do I have to be behind? Why am I not next to him, holding hands or right in front of him, “Come this way, idiot?” MB: I don’t want her behind me, she’ll be kicking me butt. EB: So even phrases like that tell women, “You’re behind.” Well not me, I’m sorry, not me. Actually, I believe that we have been where we are because we have moved each other equally. He has been a better person for what he has contributed. I have made him a better person. I remember when I was going to marry him, my father said, “Why would you make him your husband? What do you seem in him?” And I said, “Potential.” He said, “I don’t see it.” And I said, “I know that’s why I’m marrying him, not you.” But then I’m disrespectful, see? But the potential, I knew. I couldn’t be pushing him from the front or the back, he needed an equal partner that wanted to do the same thing because if not, there’s no way that he would have gotten to where he is now from where he come from. But I knew that, and he knew me before we got married. So, he knew when to be there, and when to stay away, when to understand when I’m being, “Yeah this is real.” MB: When I’m close to losing a body part and I need to… EB: That’s me being real. So, I cannot just be me because of me, I have been influenced by many, but I’ve also been supported to be the woman that I am with him. Because if not, I will still be fighting, and he had told me how to let go of 66 some things. He had told me not to overthink so much that that’s another thing we woman do. That’s just natural or instinctively. MB: No, it is physiologically because of the prefrontal cortex is developed and the connections. EB: Okay, whatever that’s when he’s just being… MB: Physiologically you guys are prepared… why? EB: But he had taught me to let go and that’s good. So, I can now say that I have become me just by myself because nobody… well we have somebody who thinks that right now. You cannot be who you are just by yourself. You have to have an influence of people and people that really love you unconditionally because we have that love unconditionally. Let me tell you, this has not been easy. We have gone through therapy, we have had sessions where we open the Pandora box and we deal with that and then we put it back and then we don’t touch it again. We had the conversations where we would tell the girls when they were older, “we’re going for a ride.” So, they knew that we were not in agreement with something. But we never, ever, because I lived, and he lived like that. With parents that discussed things in front of kids that should have never been discussed. MB: And things that were said that a child should never hear their parents say. EB: So that’s something that we cleared up from the beginning, so we remove ourselves. There was never screaming behind doors. That’s something that we never allowed in our house. 67 MB: She is the only one that yells in the house. EB: But that—parents… because I lived with that and he did too. So, we never did that. So, they knew, “Oh they are going for a ride.” I would tell my daughter, “We need to go for a ride.” MB: And they tremble. EB: Yeah, because they knew already. But yeah, I think that’s what women need to do and I’m glad that we had women previously that fought for this right, not because we didn’t have a voice. And I hate when people say, “Oh now she has a voice.” She has always had a voice, now she has the platform. Yes, thank you for giving us that. I hate when I hear people say, “Oh I don’t vote.” Oh my gosh, do you want to go live in Venezuela? Do you want to go live in North Korea? Appreciate what you have. Appreciate it and be part. That’s part of your citizenship. Be there, make a difference. I’m so appreciative of all of the women that brought us here and I hope that we have—looking now, more women that will be in a position with a platform big enough that we all can hear them, and we can all applaud and support because that’s what we need. We need that. So, what are they going to say now when we have a powerful woman, there’s a man behind her? ST: Probably. Hopefully they are together, side-by-side. EB: Darn it. ST: Holding hands… because that would be really… 68 EB: You should see my girls in my classrooms. I will have a shy girl that comes in and by the end of the year, the mom’s will say, “What happened?” And I say, “me.” MB: That’s true. EB: That’s what happened because I’m very much an advocate even in my classroom about, “No, you don’t do that. That’s not what we do.” MB: That’s like Julie in my classroom. Super shy, but not anymore. No, I don’t believe in shy women. EB: You can be reserved. You can be an observant but shy? What? Have you heard somebody say to a boy, “You’re shy. He’s a shy boy.” Have you heard that at parent teacher conference? A teacher says, ‘He’s a bossy boy.” ST: No. EB: To who they say shy and bossy? ST: Women. EB: Why? I don’t get it. ST: I don’t know, because with men it’s more—they are driven. They’ve got all of these managerial qualities and then the woman is like, “You’re bossy and you’re the b word.” EB: I don’t get it. ST: It’s not fair. 69 EB: I tell my parents, “She’s going to be a future CEO” And parents say, “What does that mean?” She knows how to handle a crowd. She’s a leader. Oh yeah, she always tells people what to do, that’s a CEO. I will never ever use that kind of language about my girls, I even show my girls that come in class that commercial that says, ‘Throw like a girl.” Have you seen that commercial? And I will say, “If I ever hear any of you using the term of a girl as something negative, you’re going to have to see Señora Beltrán. So please don’t. And I always bring those thinking prompts to them, like for example, my thinking prompt in 6th grade was for three years, “Is there something that you believe a woman, or a man can only do?” You should see the answers. “Of course! Of course, there is!” You see the papers and then I do it again at the end of the year and it completely changes to, “Physiologically men can only do these things. And women these things.” But at the beginning it was, “Of course there is!” And they don’t think about physiologically, they are only thinking about activities of performance. That I will take with me of my success that for many years I was in a classroom where I helped move that. Even you will see, for example, I’m in a dark mood. What the darker the color the worst it is? Isn’t black the presence of all colors? I don’t get it. So even those conversations I had with my students. Trying to instill inside of them hope for the future of America because it’s hard. It’s hard when you have all of these things coming at you and you’re like, “What should I believe?” That you are you and that you are powerful. That’s all. ST: Awesome. Do you have anything else to cover that we… EB: No. 70 ST: This has been a fantastic interview. EB: Oh good.