Oral History Program Richard T. Fry Interviewed by Jerry Gren 11 March 1975 i Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Richard T. Fry Interviewed by Jerry Gren 11 March 1975 Copyright © 2012 by Weber State University, Stewart Library ii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. Archival copies are placed in University Archives. The Stewart Library also houses the original recording so researchers can gain a sense of the interviewee's voice and intonations. Project Description The Weber State College/University Student Projects have been created by students working with several different professors on the Weber State campus. The topics are varied and based on the student's interest or task for a specific assignment. These oral history assignments were created to help Weber State students learn the value and importance of recording public history and to benefit the expansion of the Weber State oral history collections. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management All literary rights in the manuscript, including the right to publish, are reserved to the Stewart Library of Weber State University. No part of the manuscript may be published without the written permission of the University Librarian. Requests for permission to publish should be addressed to the Administration Office, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, Utah, 84408. The request should include identification of the specific item and identification of the user. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Fry, Richard, an oral history by Jerry Gren, 11 March 1975, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. iii Abstract: The following is an oral history interview with Richard T. Fry. The interview was conducted on March 11, 1975, by Jerry R. Gren. Fry discusses the flood that caused settlers to move their cabins to Monday Town, the development of Richville to provide ties for railroad building, the coming of the railroad in 1869, and other developments in the Morgan area. JG: Mr. Fry, I would like to know a little about your personal history–your birthday, place of birth, and such. RF: Mr. Gren, I have passed my 85th birthday on February 25 of this year. I was born in 1888. I have held a number of public jobs, the first being county clerk, held for four years, after which I was postmaster for 12 years, taught school at Devil’s Slide. I was the mayor of Morgan City at the time that the municipal electric system was installed. We went into the power and light business, and now have our own electric, water, and sewer systems, not so much through my efforts, but the cooperation of many dedicated people. This took place in 1915. JG: Now, I would like to ask you about Monday Town. What were occurrences that brought about the town? RF: After the settlers had gotten in here in the fall of 1862 most settled near the streams because that was the natural place to locate because of the shade and water. But during the winter of 1862-63, there was an unprecedented snowfall, which brought unprecedented floods in the spring. Some of the old journals recorded, “I looked out and could see water from mountain to mountain.” 1 JG: I guess we should mention that this is Morgan Valley we are talking about. RF: It was called Weber Valley rather than Morgan until there was a reason for changing it, which is another interesting story. JG: The floods caused the problem (the move to a new location)? Why was it called Monday Town? RF: A number of names were submitted during a meeting called to make the decision to either leave the valley or relocate on higher ground. Mr. T. R. G. Welch offered some high ground he owned, known as Welch’s Corner. It would be a good place to build a town. The decision was made to accept this offer. They started the next morning – Monday – to move their homes. The women marked and numbered the individual logs; the homes were dismantled and reassembled on the new location. Within about 10 days the move was completed. There were about 14 families who transferred their homes to this new location. The question of a name for the new site came up. Some 20 names were suggested, including Welch’s Corner, but Welch himself was against this. Then someone suggested that since relocation began on Monday, they should call it Monday Town. It has been known since as Monday Town Hollow. The last families to live in Monday Town were the Morris and Kingston families. I was a small boy when Brother Morris heard a commotion in his pig pen during the night. He had a sow that had farrowed several piglets. He went out and there was a big bear in the pen. He didn’t know what to do, but he had a spade handy, so he picked it up and went after the bear (and it was a big one), and killed it with his spade. The yarn has been told and retold and stretched, but it is an incident that really happened. 2 JG: You told me your father was born there. RF: Yes, he was born there. He told me that many times. JG: So your grandfather was one of the original settlers there? RF: Yes, he was one of the originators. JG: You told me you are probably the oldest remaining person with firsthand knowledge of Monday Town. RF: I have it in the book, Mountains Conquered, written by me in connection with the publication of this book. It is also contained in the booklet Pioneers of Morgan County, published in commemoration of Utah’s 1947 centennial. JG: Do you think Monday Town left its permanent mark on the history of Morgan? RF: Couldn’t find Monday Town now unless you had known where it was or had someone show you. JG: Do you think it has had an effect on your life? RF: I had to drive cows there when I was a boy, with the bear story in the back of my mind. Many times I have run out of there thinking a bear would be after me. Occasionally some people would move their houses out again into the valley. Some people lived in dugouts in the hollow. As these people left and new ones came in, they used the dugouts for pigpens. One by one the houses did disappear, even the hearthstones. Some of the lucky people had flat sandstones for floors, but most just had dirt. JG: You told me when the main population had moved from Monday Town and new immigrants came into the valley, they used the vacant houses in Monday Town. 3 RF: Yes, they stayed there until they were able to relocate someplace else. Sometimes it took them one, two, or three years. They didn’t have much, and people didn’t have much to give them. The last family to move from Monday Town was the Morrises. The Kingston’s moved about two years before this. JG: What I wanted to make a point of was the people who moved in were quite poor and walked in with just bags on their backs. RF: Yes, but the people who were already here weren’t too well off, but they sent them to Monday Town because they didn’t have room for them in their own one or two room houses. But they helped them however they could. The bigger brick homes were built after the railroad came through in 1869. JG: I understand, Mr. Fry that after the railroad came through another town quite similar to Monday Town grew. RF: That’s true. At the mouth of what’s called Richville Hollow a town sprang up because there was water coming down out of it and it was on high ground. Shaping or making of railroad ties was the main purpose of this settlement. Ties were brought out of Hardscrabble. One branch of Hardscrabble was known as Pole Hollow. There were thousands of beautiful trees just the right size to make into ties for the railroad. They were shaped and loaded and taken and placed along the railroad tracks, as far east as Echo and as far west as Ogden. JG: How were those ties shaped? Did they have machinery? RF: No. They were done by hand with an axe. But later on they set up a sawmill at the site. Later still, they put in a flour mill. You can get that out of Mountains Conquered. 4 JG: Was this a large community, or was it about the same size as Monday Town? RF: The tie camp, at one time there must have been at least 100 families living there. (This was before the city of Morgan was laid out.) The people who made money from the railroad by subcontracting ties, hauling, etc. used that money to build North Morgan and South Morgan, the railroad being the dividing line between the two. North Morgan never had the water troubles because they were located on higher ground. JG: Were the Riches the people who cut the ties and gave the name to the settlement? RF: No, the Riches were farmers. The Riches and Waldrons made their money raising oats to feed the horses and mules that hauled the ties and rails for the railroad. The early homes were made of hand-hewn logs. Some had the sandstone for floors and hearths; most had dirt floors. The walls were packed with clay instead of plaster. JG: What were the roofs made of? Were they regular wood shingles? RF: No, they were clay. The clay came from the hill by the old city cemetery. JG: They had a clay shingle then, or was it just clay packed over the roof structure? RF: They put poles for rafters, then willows, then straw, and then the clay. If they didn’t clay it every year, it would leak. JG: What is the building behind the stake center that has been preserved? RF: That is the first building built in Morgan County. It was built by Charles Sreeve Peterson. The DUP (Daughters of Utah Pioneers) moved it up here. JG: Was the tie camp settlement in Richville called Richville at that time? RF: No, not at first, but they later named that for John Rich. 5 JG: Getting back to Monday Town – how big do you think it was at its largest? RF: I don’t think there was ever more than 14 houses, but there were the dugouts, too. JG: Do you have any idea how many dugouts there were? RF: I could only make a guess, but it wouldn’t be any better than yours. I do have firsthand knowledge of the houses because I used to cut through there when I was a boy, and I remember seeing houses of the construction we have discussed. JG: Did your father tell you of any more interesting stories? RF: Plenty of them. There was the time they tried to kill the grizzly. Grandfather had lost a couple of calves and a sheep or two, down right where he lived. There was a lot of brush, so he didn’t know what type of animal was killing them. He felt bad about losing his stock, so he came and told the townspeople of his troubles. They all came to help, but the mistake they made – everybody brought their dogs. If they hadn’t taken the dogs, they would have killed the bear. They didn’t get the bear, but chased it off with the dogs. JG: Did they ever get it? RF: Yes. There was an old fellow lived here in the early days. I knew him well. He had one of the most peculiar names. His name was Truelove Manhard. He was an old bear hunter and knew what he was doing. He followed the bear into what is known as Pine Canyon. By this time the bear was quite winded, and Manhard got him. JG: In conclusion, Mr. Fry, do you feel Monday Town had any effect on the history of Morgan? 6 RF: Yes because the majority of the people wanted leave the valley because it was completely covered with water. The old journals will verify this. But because of Welch offering this ground, they stayed, and the community continued to grow. The same thing is true about the settlement of Richville. It was also very effective in the growth of this area. JG: So Monday Town provided a place of refuge so the people could stay, and Richville provided the economic encouragement. RF: Yes. Richville provided the first means for buying materials from the outside needed for progress and development. JG: I would like to thank you for the interview. RF: If I can help you in any way, I’ll be glad to do it. 7