Oral History Program Julian Johnson Interviewed by Marion Mendez 29 August 1971 i Oral History Program Weber State University Stewart Library Ogden, Utah Julian Johnson Interviewed by Marion Mendez 29 August 1971 Copyright © 2014 by Weber State University, Stewart Library ii Mission Statement The Oral History Program of the Stewart Library was created to preserve the institutional history of Weber State University and the Davis, Ogden and Weber County communities. By conducting carefully researched, recorded, and transcribed interviews, the Oral History Program creates archival oral histories intended for the widest possible use. Interviews are conducted with the goal of eliciting from each participant a full and accurate account of events. The interviews are transcribed, edited for accuracy and clarity, and reviewed by the interviewees (as available), who are encouraged to augment or correct their spoken words. The reviewed and corrected transcripts are indexed, printed, and bound with photographs and illustrative materials as available. Archival copies are placed in Special Collections. The Stewart Library also houses the original recording so researchers can gain a sense of the interviewee's voice and intonations. Project Description The Weber State College/University Student Projects have been created by students working with several different professors on the Weber State campus. The topics are varied and based on the student's interest or task for a specific assignment. These oral history assignments were created to help Weber State students learn the value and importance of recording public history and to benefit the expansion of the Weber State oral history collections. ____________________________________ Oral history is a method of collecting historical information through recorded interviews between a narrator with firsthand knowledge of historically significant events and a well-informed interviewer, with the goal of preserving substantive additions to the historical record. Because it is primary material, oral history is not intended to present the final, verified, or complete narrative of events. It is a spoken account. It reflects personal opinion offered by the interviewee in response to questioning, and as such it is partisan, deeply involved, and irreplaceable. ____________________________________ Rights Management All literary rights in the manuscript, including the right to publish, are reserved to the Stewart Library of Weber State University. No part of the manuscript may be published without the written permission of the University Librarian. Requests for permission to publish should be addressed to the Administration Office, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, Utah, 84408. The request should include identification of the specific item and identification of the user. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows: Johnson, Julian, an oral history by Marion Mendez, 29 August 1971, WSU Stewart Library Oral History Program, University Archives, Stewart Library, Weber State University, Ogden, UT. iii Abstract: This is an interview of Julian Johnson by Marion Mendez on August 29, 1971 for the Utah Oral History Program in the home of Mr. and Mrs. Julian Johnson, 2601 Jefferson Avenue in Ogden, Utah, at 5:15 P.M. MM: Please tell me something about your life and your ancestor’s life. JJ: My life has been for the last 25 years of something extraordinary. All I could think of about my grandparents, the parents of my parents, which came from the city of Mexico. When they arrived in this place, they found a job on a ranch for a man who talked English. Our last name before was really Manchaca, but when my grandparents found this work with this rancher his name was Johnson. From there my grandparents got the last name Johnson, and in the generations from there till now we have started using the last name Johnson. My parents were not very elevated in education. I think my father went to the 5th book, my mother graduated from the 8th book. They were not very educated and they were not people of very much money. They made their life working in the ranch. The occupation of my father was working in a machine that cut wood for quite a long time in his life. His experiences of working in this machine took us like a united family to live with him there. It seemed like the mountain life was quite different from the city with regard to the unity of the people. Nevertheless, the family was usually united and we were both workers. They were real strong to give us both, me and my sister, the education necessary. To this moment we owe them this. My family is not big. It consist of my father and my mother and one sister. This time we are separated the four of us, my father and mother live quite far from each other, my sister and I live quite far. We do not see each other consistently. Usually the contact and communication that 1 we have between us is still intimate. We love each other as brother and sister. Usually my parents gave us the responsibility to work, to make one think, to make one feel responsible, in doing our work and honor our money. With the respect we had for our parents, we usually did and tried to agree for our own good being. They usually showed us the way to respect other people. They showed us the respect of parents and the important necessity of the home. Out home was quite united when we started school my mother occupied herself a lot with us. We were clean, we wore the best clothes we had. Usually the pushed the education, even though my father did not see education as a necessity. My mother always emphasized that we should go to school and get an education, the most that was possible. She always preoccupied herself that we did our best that was possible to learn. We went on time, we did our lessons, studied well, and at times that we went faithfully to school. Me and my sister finished high school, and there our education finished, and this we owe in gratitude to our parents. Even though, like I said my father doesn't think education is very important. He couldn't see what the necessity of education was. Now I cans see that the education has helped me a great deal to live my personal life. The school where we went was not an extraordinary school. It was a humble school. It was a Catholic School, where they taught Catholicism, where we learn to pray, and all that was necessary to become a good Catholic. We went to this school, and relatives of mine graduated from this school. We did not finish school there. There was a time my father had to move from this city to another city because of a job. We started to go to a public school and this was in 1958 when we moved for the first time to the city of Espanola, until we finished high school and there we met our friends, our families. The school was a big change in our lives, 2 because we were in a bigger city and we were going to a bigger school. We knew more people, we made new friends, however, what surrounded us was new and all this was interesting. We were interested in going to school and we finished. We started working very young in that time. My father and mother had a separation and up until now they do not live together. My mother brought us up, raised us, helped us, and strengthened herself so that we could do our best. We respect her and give thanks to God for her. She taught us the respect, she showed us love, she gave us her love. My poor mother sacrificed so that we could have the necessary things for school, she strengthened herself to work to maintain us, and there we learned the necessity to work like a united family which didn't leave more than us, the three of us started to work. I remember the first job that I had, was in a hospital. In my first year of high school I worked there. It was a very big experience, real good for me, because I learned the responsibility of living with people in public and this interested me. The work in the hospital was something that made me see that there was a lot of necessity in the world for everyone. I remember my mother got up in the morning so I could go to school. When I got home late from school, she already had my food and my clothes so I could go to my job. I remember that she wafted until I got out of work and returned back to the place she waited, always with a big smile on her face, happy because we were helping her not only in the material form but also with honor. We always had respect for them we never did anything extraordinary to cause them pain, because really we were afraid of them. She showed us how to be scared, she was quite strict with us, and she didn't let us do what we wanted to do. She taught us the doctrine. She emphasized the doctrine even though she was quite weak in her faith to serve the church. It didn't really much matter 3 to her but she always emphasized that we go to church, and try to do the best possible. This taught us, it helped us, and this encouraged us to do it because she was always forcing herself do it. Never that I can remember did we cause bur mother great pain, never did we cause her a heartache, even though it would be our fault but always our mother worried for us. I remember when we started to go out with our friends. We would go quite late and after work we would go enjoy ourselves. I remember when we got there she wanted to be sure we were all right. She gave us our scolding’s but she never got mad in such a way that sorrow or discontentment with her. We were usually in a grateful and loving atmosphere. Until these, moments I can say during our life we have lived almost without a father. Whatever my mother taught us was a lot of work for her, and as I said, she made an effort so we could have the best. We cannot say our mother was weak in our personal education or home education. Although, she doesn’t know much of the Bible but always she emphasized the "Lord's Fear" and He was capable of what happened in our lives. For all this we to the Lord, because He has been great in our lives, and educated us. When we came to the state of Utah it had already been 10 or 12 years that we hadn't seen our father since he left us. My wife and I came to look for him, to see what he looked like and how he was. When we found him we rejoiced. He received us in good spirit, and until this moment he has treated us real nice. The reason we came to look for him was that I wanted to get to know him once more. My wife wanted to know him for the first time. We were anxious to see him, but hadn't heard from him, the only thing we knew was what his sister told us and our cousins when they use to come to the state of Utah to visit him. They would tell us how he was and that he was working, but we never received absolutely no mail from him. When we saw him for 4 the first time it was a glorious and happy meeting, because he rejoiced seeing us and us him. Until this moment, we have been seeing him. I still love him as my father even though he left his responsibility of caring for us. It has been a long time since but I can't hold a grudge against him for this reason. Whatever happened between mother and him, it was their business and not ours, even though he lost us as his responsibility, I still love him because he is my father. MM: Could you tell me of some experiences in school? JJ: Yes. In high school I was starting to participate in games. For example, the game of basketball and track. I loved it because I had the exercise I needed, and at the same time it was a challenge to my personal life. I remember the first year I went out for the sport of track. The practice was quite difficult, quite laborious. We tried to do our best to win the race, to beat the one that was running against me. This experience taught me to know my own self. I remember the first time we went out to run against another school, the race was a mile. I came in third place which made me feel very honored, because it is quite a long distance that one had to run. It takes a lot of exercise and courage to do our best. That was one of my greatest experiences in my life. The first race I felt very happy and very honored because I was able to have victory in a certain way. I noticed that my courage and time that I had spent to gain this victory was rewarded with a small trophy which had a great meaning, and this is the work that I had done. Another experience I had in school was when I started high school, there was a group of young people which were called "Future Teachers”, and in this group we were taught the teacher’s methods. Ever week on Thursday we would go to a grade school from first to sixth grade, and there for one entire day we taught the classes. This also taught me the 5 form of a teacher and how they teach. It taught me the pressure a teacher has to teach, when the class is not listening and this taught me also to study, learn, and to listen better. When one teaches and the people don’t listen, it becomes very difficult to introduce what one is trying to teach. MM: Why are the teachers called “Future”? JJ: This group of young people were introducing people that would like to be teachers. Later on as they finished high school they kept on with their higher education in a college or university. These people were people that were interested in teaching grade schools, or high schools, or even teachers for colleges. All it means is persons that are prepared to teach. That’s what is called “Future Teachers”, or teachers for the future. This was a reason to give us an opportunity to teach and also learn. MM: What did you do at the hospital? JJ: I worked in the hospital for three years. At first, I washed dishes. I washed them for about four weeks. Then I was change to the dietary department, where I learned to cook different foods. I worked there close to eight months. After six months, there was an opening for a janitor and I took it. I worked cleaning the hospital for four months and after finishing this there was an opportunity for an orderly. I took it. This was my job until I terminated. This was to feed the patient, make sure he was comfortable, and if there was a necessity to call the doctor, and be right close to them and just help the nurses with patients. This work was very interesting. It’s a clean job. It required a person that has patience and can take the responsibility of the patient. The pressure that is in a hospital is a lot. There is pressure from the patient, from the doctor, the nurses, and from the persons who are helping one. It is a very delicate job that requires a lot of 6 knowledge of what one is doing. Actually any person can do this work, if they have the desire to do so. One learns a lot to like the people, to have compassion, and mercy, because when one sees a person in critical condition one feels pity for them and when a person dies on one's arms, it brings sorrow to one. I remember my first experiences I had with a young girl she was 17 or 18 years old. This young girl was on a bad accident, and was in the hospital about 6 weeks. During the time that she was there, other persons were taking care of her. They knew she was in critical condition, because it read on the reports. When she passed to eternity, that afternoon was my turn to take care of and give her water. I remember when I entered her room and seen her very sick, I went close to her and offered her water. She drank the water and laid back again, and she died. I got quite stirred up. I didn’t know what to do, whether to call for help, ring the bell, or leave the patient there. I didn’t know what to do, but I was able to control myself and called the nurse. This was an outstanding experience for me, because it was the first time in life I was able to see the end of a person’s life. This was very sad for me, it was hard to understand. On another occasion, while I worked in the emergency room, during one evening, one of my best friends was in an accident too. He was brought to the hospital, but the poor boy was dead already. I went and took him off the truck where he was brought on, and I laid him on the bed and I realized he was dead. He was not breathing anymore. He was one of my fellow workers. This too made me feel very sad. This is why I say that the work at the hospital requires of a person that can handle the responsibility, have pity, have a gentle heart, kindly, because it is hard to understand and see so many sick persons. MM: What did you do when you left the hospital? 7 JJ: When I left, I had gotten married. The wages at the hospital were not enough to pay rent and to support us. I went out to seek employment at a filling station, and I started working in the city of Santa Fe, it was about 25 miles from Espanola where we lived. Day after day I traveled, I worked at the filling station close to one year. One of my brothers-in-law helped me find this job. This was a new experience for me, because I learned a lot and I was still dealing with the public. Then I terminated my job at this filling station, and went to Denver. There I tried to find an occupation that I could have a future in life. I went to school for 6 months doing "Recapping School". There I learned that job. I returned to Espanola, New Mexico, again and started working in a tire shop. There I didn't do what I had learned, but I started selling tires and it's been 5 years since I have been working selling tires. This also has been a great experience in my life, because one learns every day to deal with the public, and at the same time, one learns of how in the space of 10 years the method of how the tires are changed, and there are a lot of things one learns. However, working with tires is very dangerous, it has caused violent deaths. I remember an experience that caused death working with tires. I remember an experience I had working with a tire, while I put air in it, the tire did not want to seal, it did want to rise up right and the tire must have had about 60 or 70 pounds of air when it exploded. The tire flew up in the air about 30 feet, I was standing quite far from the tire but it caused me to get frightened. Since then I have kept a close watch on how I did it. I have had great experiences on this job and which up until today I have enjoyed doing this work. MM: What did your mother teach you of the doctrine? 8 JJ: My mother taught us to be respectful and to attend church faithfully and to have reverence for church, as far as doctrine, I guess my mother didn't know much even though she taught us. She taught us the purpose of praying and the customs of the church and she taught us the methods how one tries to serve God and Catholicism, because this is would educate us. This is the principle personal education the Catholic Church has for its young people, because one can have the first communion in church after learning Catholicism. This our mother put great emphasis to me and my sister, she pushed us to learn it. MM: What is the Catholic's church principle education? JJ: The principle education or doctrine of the Catholic Church is to serve the saints and do good deeds, this religion believes in doing good deeds to earn the kingdom of God by doing this, this is the way it has been explained to me. They emphasize on their idols in the images they make, they believe this idols existed once, and is the principle help they believe in having. They believe in Jesus Christ and that the virgin gave birth to Him. They believe that they can get through to Christ through means of his mother, Mary, and this is what they emphasize. They don’t have a preferred idol in the church, but every idol is important to them. Their education is to do good deeds and be reverent to their idols and to sacrifice offerings, pay for Masses, and it is a routine and a lot of customs. One thing I can say in favor of the Catholic Church is that it is a religion that has reverence in church, the house where they worship. They believe in being attentive, quiet, and faithful. In some places their first mass is at 6 in the morning. I remember my parents, I was an altar boy, a mass follower, and there I was able to learn their doctrine. How they try to serve God. I remember some of the sermons that the priest preached of 9 their teachings and all this was very interesting. Although their doctrine is different according to the Bible's explanation. MM: How did you feel while studying the doctrine? JJ: When I studied the Catholic doctrine, it interested me in a way that brought the desire in my personal life to become an altar boy. The desire became very great, to become a priest. I believed that if a person would give himself to serve God in this church, he would have better opportunity to inherit the kingdom of God. I tried to serve in church as an altar boy, but the desire was there to do something better, to do something major. So my desire became to be a priest. When the major masses were celebrated like the mass of Easter Sunday or Christmas, I was the master of ceremonies. The priest would send for other priests from Mexico to come and celebrate the mass with them. These people would encourage me, they would talk to me, and would tell me how good they felt. This was a very interesting profession. They felt so close to God and so this encouraged me to try and become a priest. I took a test to enter school, they accepted me and all this encouraged me. I tried to become more and more interested. I remember that at one time my mother opposed me going into the ministry of a priest for the reason that I would leave her alone. Her excuse was, if you go, we will be alone. It’s going be sad and awful to us. But nevertheless she finally gave in and said, if this is the desire you have in your heart and this is what you want to do in life we can't stop you go ahead and do it. However I was all ready to have this ministry, so I had already been accepted to be educated. At the same time there was an instant change. I didn’t go to school. MM: What kind of questions are asked on the tests? 10 JJ: They ask of the importance of the Catholicism. If one wants to separate from everything, from the communication of the world. This means enjoying yourself in dances and one has to leave his friends, and one has to be a different person. Logical questions that are concern to a personal life, the way one has to live. If one is willing to follow their rules, to separate from the pleasure of this world, to leave his parents and to suffer. There are questions which makes one think before entering this kind of work. The beginning of school is not the beginning of the ministry that one is studying and no one is forced. One can finish his high school. You can go to the last term which is to be received as a priest. The questions that are made to one, makes one think if one is really willing to take such a position in that one’s life. MM: When you finished the test how did you feel? JJ: I felt very privileged because I was able to take the test. At the same time with great fear because some of the questions were difficult, and at the same time I didn’t know if I had answered what they expected. It made me feel sad for some time. But when I received the results of the test a month after, I could see I had been accepted. I was qualified to go to school. MM: Can you tell me something the priest used to say? JJ: The priest from our church would call us once in a while. He would take some of his time and would teach us and would explain the methods and importance of a priest, what we should do. We would advise us to start preparing ourselves and to separate from the things that didn’t belong in a priest’s life. They should be respectful persons and reverent. I remember a phrase the priest used each time he called us and would explain. It was almost the same thing. He would explain and tell us in order that you will 11 be respected by others, you must first learn that respect for your own self. This was his phrase he used which made us think deeply. It made us think of the Priest’s life. At first it seemed very monotonous and a very solitary life. When we were able to listen to their testimonies, how they would occupy themselves studying, visiting, making good deeds, and the trips they have to make. This, though, taught us that these people were busy in a way that they didn’t have time to think or feel depressed. They would always teach us, would call us on their time and would explain to us how to live. How a priest had to teach the town and the people how to behave. They said the responsibility lays on the one who is teaching, which is the priest. MM: Which was the change in your life? JJ: The change that I had, for which I was not able to receive the education for Priest, was in one occasion at Christmas time a very humble church where we made our way to go celebrate our mass. They were celebrating Christmas program which was concerning the birth of Jesus. My sister was invited to this program by some girls and she accepted the invitation. My mother gave her permission to go and she said was going, and she went. As I was going to the Catholic Church to make preparations as master of ceremonies, I used to go plenty early to prepare what was necessary. It was about 9:30. I stopped there at the church, while the program took place I was able to listen to it. It interested me very well. There was no clear message at that moment. However, I went ahead and had mass at the Catholic Church and finished it. Nothing happened, and my sister continued going to church on Sundays with them on the evenings. I had been taught that if the Catholic or we like Catholics interested into another Church other than the Catholic Church it was a sin. This was our parent’s doctrine. They taught us this 12 way. I was opposed that my sister went there but I never made an argument about it. If my mother agreed for her to go, then she knew what she was doing. My sister kept going to the church. I remember she learned some of the choruses and some of the songs they sang there. I remember that same year for New Year’s about in 1964 my sister went to church and me and my friends we went to a dance and about one in the morning we came home. My sister had gone to this service before a holiday that the church was having. My mother told me to go for my sister at the Pentecostal church where she was to bring her home. We went, my friends and I, to bring her, and as we went out we met her on the way, the girls were bringing her home already. One of my wife's brothers which was killed in Vietnam, told me “Julian I want to invite you to come Sunday afternoon with me to a service in Hernandez over in New Mexico, and I accepted the invitation, because it had always been impossible for me to say no. I went with them to the services, but there was no reaction in my life. In one occasion sometime after this a group of singers named "The Libby Band" were there in this certain church. One of the boys invited me to go to church and listen to their singing, I remember that the preacher that was preaching that night made a statement. "Do you know Jesus Christ as your faithful friend?" This made me think, now, can one know Jesus Christ as their faithful friend? When we believe that the only contact we are able to have is through his mother Mary. This made me think, and at the same time it made me have doubts, and in the form they had their service I didn’t like it because I was not used to them. We were used to one certain way. Here everyone sang and clapped their hands and they hollered and they moved, and this for me was out of order. The phrase he used when he finished preaching to make the altar call. I went forth so they’d pray for 13 me. He asked if we knew him as our personal friend. At the same time he asked how many don’t know him. I raised my hand, because I actually didn’t know him. As I passed to the altar to be prayed for, a certain preacher came close and laid his hands on my back. He said to me “if you don’t know the lord as your personal friend, receive him now. I knelt down and I said in my mind. I was not going to receive nothing, because I was a Catholic. I was about to enter in the ministry. I had decided to receive nothing. However, as I went home, I went confused. I thought how could one know the Lord Jesus Christ as a personal friend? Sometime later after this I met some evangelists or preachers. He was a brethren from the state of Texas. He had a revival in a church that was about 10 miles from the city where we lived. The time he spent on this revival this man preached with words that were direct, words that stir my soul, my heart. It was there where I had my first conviction in my life. Where I saw that not only did I had to know the Lord Jesus Christ as a personal friend, but I had to know him as the door to the Kingdom of Heaven. This man was the one to plant the first seed in my heart. It stirred me so that I could become a Christian or to receive Christ as my personal savior. It was not long after, about 8 months after, the Lord in a service of the Women’s Missionary Counsel which is a group of women in the church that backs up the church a great deal with work they do, in one of their services, I received the Lord as my personal Savior. A sermon preached by my father-in-law which touched my heart and stirred my soul. I was able to render all my heart to the Lord Jesus Christ. This was the change I obtained or that took place in my life that change my determination to become a priest. The major change was this, because I already knew the Lord Jesus Christ as my personal savior. Here I was able to realize that I was blind. This is talking spiritually, 14 because I received blessings from our Lord Jesus Christ. I received a very great experience which I had not received in religion I use to serve as assistant of the priest. In this religion I was able to receive what I never knew. Up to this moment, not trying to talk against the Catholic Church, but our doctrine is different and it is a complete Gospel. As member of the Assembly of God, I believe it is a complete Gospel, and I believe in doctrine of the Bible. MM: What did you feel when you went to pray? JJ: The prayer that we had learned were words that others had composed. They were phrases that we learn, and that we resided. When they made the altar call to pray for salvation and repentances, I remember as I pass to the altar to be prayed for, I felt a tremendous load in my life. I couldn't decide whether to become a Christian or become a priest. I went to the altar to be prayed for and to render myself to the Lord. While I was at the altar, I could fill a load upon my soul, my heart. I remember that there on my knees I extended my arms to heaven and I told the Lord to come into my heart, change my life, do whatever you want of my life. He came and touched my life, my heart and took the burden that I felt. I was a very hard person to cry for tears to come out, and I remember when I felt the Lords blessing, the first thing I noticed were tears running down my cheeks, which I couldn't understand because there was so much happiness in my soul and in my life. I couldn't find words to explain this. All I could do was cry. I didn't cry because of sorrow or pain, but they were tears of joy, because I knew I had obtained a precious experience of great value in my life. MM: What did this man that preached say, when you felt something for the first time? 15 JJ: This brethren from the state of Texas preached repentance. I remember he said, the only way into the kingdom of God was through the Lord Jesus Christ. Before this, I had heard the phrase, "Do you know the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal friend?", and now as I listened to another brother preach repentance and that the Lord Jesus was the only inference to the Kingdom of God. It made me think. Why didn't I know if I was really ready or not to enter the Kingdom of God? If I would go with the Lord when I died, or if something would happen to me in my life. This brother preached repentance the way it was necessary for one to change. The danger one's soul is in if we are apart from the Lord Jesus Christ. MM: What was the massage your father-in-law preached? JJ: That message that my father-in-law-preached was about repentance and the need to serve God with all our hearts. Being that it was a missionary service he emphasized more in missionary work. He saw the need of every soul. He knew I still didn't know the Lord as my personal Savior, and there he brought this sermon about repentance. I remember the words he said when he finish his sermon, there is a need of persons that are able to preach that can work in church, there is a need of people that love the Lord, that are saved so that they can introduce other people to the Lord Jesus Christ. His message was not directly on salvation, but, nevertheless, the spirt of the Lord was dealing with me. When he made the alter call, and put the emphasis on the need to serve the Lord in church. Then my mind went back to the moments when I had had the opportunity to enter the ministry as a priest. As my father-in-law said these words, it made me think a little more how I could serve the Lord with all my heart, and render my life to him. When he made the call and said if you don't know the Lord as your personal 16 Savior, and if your desire is to t work for the Lord then this night is your best opportunity, because you can fine the Lord as your personal Savior. After you have found the Lord as your personal savior, you may serve in church. He gives the experience and power to serve Him. These were the words that brought me to the Lord. The desire to serve Him in church. As I said my desire was to become a priest and here it seem the door to this opportunity was opened. So that I could preach, and serve the Lord as I should do it. MM: What is Salvation? JJ: It is somewhat difficult to explain with words, but salvation is the change of man. The repentance of man is a deed that only the Lord Jesus Christ can do. Salvation for me is when God transforms the life of man. When the Lord comes to deal personally in the life of man. When in His mercy and love He came to give the person to Him with all His heart. He gives him the opportunity to know him personally. It's a change that only God can do. It is impossible for any man to change another man’s heart. This is talking spiritually. MM: What is the Holy Spirit? JJ: The Holy Spirit is the third person in the Holy Trinity. The one which gives the person, the Christian, the power to resist sin and temptation. The Holy Spirit is a form that gives a person knowledge, and direction. It is a power to keep one from sin, and it is one of the most important things that a Christian can obtain. The Doctrine is not that necessary like the presence of the Lord in our life. It's the same presence of the Lord in our live, the Holy Spirit. 17 MM: What is the difference to be saved and receive the Holy Spirit? JJ: Without salvation a person cannot inter the Kingdom of God. Salvation is important. It's when one knows Jesus Christ as his personal savior. It's the most important thing in a man's life, because without salvation no one inters the Kingdom. The difference between the Holy Spirit and salvation, is that the Holy Spirit is the one who gives strength and power to obtain a happier life, more powerful and closer to God. MM: How did you feel when you received the Holy Spirit? JJ: When I received the Holy Spirit, I noticed that the things I desired from this world were finished, the desires were gone. I had more strength to resist temptation and I had more strength to resist sin. The Holy Spirit guided me to pray, concentrate in my prayer, gave me the strength to be able to talk, study, and discover new things in my Christian life. MM: What do you think of the spiritual revolution that involves the young people around the world? JJ: In young people there is no respect, no interest in spiritual things. It seems like the young people in one way or another the devil has won their minds and they don't think of the things of God. I don't mean that the young people don't think of God, a lot of them realize that there is a God, they realize that the Lord Jesus Christ died on the cross to give us eternal life, but somehow the young people have lost interest in God. There is no religion for them just for the old folks. They have lost the desire to serve God. MM: Could you please explain how you conduct your services? JJ: Yes, this is what was strange to me to serve in the Pentecostal church. It is that it started with prayer, right after came where the need of the people is presented before 18 God, which we call requests, where we all unite together to ask God's help for all the people, the other part is the testimonies, where we all thank God for his blessings that he gives us, and at last the most important comes the sermon and the alter. We receive the word of God which builds us up and gives us courage and helps us. Then we come to the altar to pray, that's when we receive blessings from God. This was very strange to me, because in the Catholic Church all we did was follow the priest. He would perform in one way. We would serve right after. The people did not have much to do but follow some of the costumes. The mass was over in 45 minutes, we would go home. This was the most difficult thing for me to understand. Why was it that in this church we worship God with requests, prayer, testimonies, sermon and then the altar? Never the less, I have noticed that up to these moments I can see what benefits there are in it, because it is not a routine, but it is something God has guided us to do. We can express how we feel with God. We can present our needs to Mm. Ask Him to help us. At the same time we nourish ourselves. I have always believed that the person who is a Christian, who loves God and is faithful, God always blesses them. My philosophy is that the soul has to be nourished by God. According to the Bible it says every blessing man receives comes from above. This means that every good benefit that comes to us comes from God. This is why I say that the soul is nourished with the Lord's blessing. The physical bodies nourishes with the vegetables of the earth which is the food from the earth. We have this privilege to know God face to face. Our souls are nourished with the Lords blessings. MM: Why do you have fellowship meetings once a month with the neighbor churches? 19 JJ: The leaders of our churches, the ministers, can get together and discuss some programs which can help to progress in church. The members from each church have communion together with us. It is a blessing to be able to get together with these churches to praise God all together. At the same time present some programs to edify our churches, and keep on doing the will of the Lord. MM: How are missionaries chosen? JJ: The missionaries are chosen according to their desire. They feel a call from God. This is the principle election that a person feels from part of God to serve in foreign lands where there is a necessity. The person that is chosen by God and feels the call to preach the gospel and helps other persons as missionaries, presents his application to the leader of our organization. They take it to a certain committee. The committee considers it and in this way they are chosen. At the same time, they have to take some tests. They are required some education. They have rules that may help them over there in time of need. MM: How do they decide where to send the missionaries? JJ: How ever the missionary feels, if the missionary feels the need to go to a certain place, and if it is necessary for him to go there, they send him. They are chosen according to that person’s desire. Let’s say if one feels the need of going to England, they present their application and if there is a way to send them there, the same church will help them to go do the labor there. I believe the missionary chooses where to go, because God has already called him where he needs him. MM: When the church has a crusade, how is it conducted? 20 JJ: The leader of the crusade asks for permit from the leaders of our dominations and if the permit is granted they start writing letters to the churches asking help from young people, if it is a crusade for young people. The young people that are invited to go, are young people who have known the Lord as their personal savior. These people go fill out their applications and send them to the one who is in charge of the crusade. They send them regulations and things they need to take. The young people who are interested in going to the crusade, they preoccupy themselves and work to make this trip where the crusade will take place. There they unite going door to door. MM: How do they decide where to have the crusades? JJ: The crusades are selected by the person who is the leader of the crusade. This person who is the leader goes from state to s ate, from city to city, where he can see that God leads him to have a crusade, they have it there. In our religion or domination we believe the Lord guides us. That is why the Holy Ghost takes its important place in our lives. Through this method these leaders can decide where the crusade will be. This is why they go to God in prayer, they ask for guidance and God through the Holy Spirit guides them and He makes them feel the need in their heart of a certain place, and then they obey the voice of God, and make their crusade and God blesses in a special way. MM: Could you please explain to me, what is the difference between the Catholic religion and the Pentecostal religion? JJ: Yes, the Catholic religion more or less is a domination where a person tries to serve God by doing good deeds, be faithful to the church, give their offerings, give their tithes, and some sacrifice their bodies by mistreating themselves trying to serve God. The complete gospel is not preached in the Catholic Church. We have a complete gospel in 21 the Pentecostal church, where salvation is preached, the necessity of salvation, where it is emphasized that the Lord Jesus Christ gave his life at the Cross of Calvary, so we could have life, and eternal life. It is a religion where according to the Bible it teaches us that works without faith is dead. We do not believe that our works will take us to heaven, but we believe in doing good works. First we have our Lord Jesus Christ as our Savior. Teaching and testifying that Christ lives forever. The difference between the two religions is that one does not preach a complete gospel, and the other one does preach it completely. Like the Lord Jesus Christ demands it in his word. MM: What is the difference when the Catholics take the Lord’s Supper and when the Pentecostals take the Lords Supper? JJ: The Catholic has taken it very reverent manner. They believe in receiving communion because it is part of the body of God. It is a very important step in their religion, and they believe it but have made it in a form of a custom. In the Pentecostal church we receive communion, in memory of the Lord Jesus Christ who died for us, shed his blood at the Cross of Calvary to give us salvation or eternal life. It's a deal that the Lord Jesus Christ has made with us. The Bible tells us one of the Lord Jesus Christ's last words were on the Lord's Supper "Take, eat; this is my body, and take the cup saying, drink ye all of it, this is my blood, do it in my memory." He gave his body and was destroyed, shed his blood so we could have salvation. When we have the Lords supper, we do it in memory of Jesus Christ. The suffering he went through, and as we remember we draw closer to God. We can feel his blessings. MM: How did you feel toward the Catholic Church? 22 JJ: I don't have anything against them, because I know in what situation they are in. They are ignorant that is of the blessing of God. I can't say they don't know anything, but they don't understand anything of what has happening in their lives. At the same time they don't worship God as necessary. I can see the difference between the two religions are great, because the Catholic Church has made in a right form, made it a custom of going in and out. I feel sad because if these people would only understand that God can touch the heart of man and heal it, and that the Lord Jesus Christ can bless their souls, they would be more content and more satisfied. MM: Thanks a lot for giving me the opportunity to have this interview. 23